Snatchday 1: Nottingham Forest Vs the PGMOL

[Notcher]

We all agree that football is the people's game and it belongs to us and I don't think anyone would dispute it. Therefore every season card holder of every club should be given a vote as to whether they want VAR or not.

They're all happy to parrot the message about the game belonging to us so let's see if they would actually allow the fans and the ones this affects to have the say from a message they repeat.

 

[JohnnyCarey]

I wouldn't mind all this Drama Queen stuff if it created an "us against the world" mentality that actually galvanised the players to fight for our lives on the pitch. But I just don't see Nuno of the Sorrows being able to use it in that way. He's already projected the points deduction as an excuse for the players being confused and demoralised -- and now we add another layer of victimhood on top of that.
So I just don't see how all of this helps us with the only thing that actually matters which is winning enough games to avoid relegation. Maybe we'll see a stunning reaction against City but alas I think it's much more likely that we'll see a team that feels sorry for itself.

 

[donny]

What do the Telegraph readers on here make to them comparing us to Donald Trump?

Premier League entering Trumpian post-truth era – led by Nottingham Forest’s social media tirades

Clubs are increasingly playing on a sense of victimhood, in a manner that would have been unthinkable a few years ago

www.telegraph.co.uk

The author of this article has hair like a Lego man, and that still isn't the worst thing about it.

 

[Rubics]

We all agree that football is the people's game and it belongs to us and I don't think anyone would dispute it. Therefore every season card holder of every club should be given a vote as to whether they want VAR or not.

They're all happy to parrot the message about the game belonging to us so let's see if they would actually allow the fans and the ones this affects to have the say from a message they repeat.

Said over a year ago on here - let’s have a season with no VAR then everybody with an interest gets a vote. One per person, owners, players, mangers, fans etc.

 

[Cloughie1975]

Said over a year ago on here - let’s have a season with no VAR then everybody with an interest gets a vote. One per person, owners, players, mangers, fans etc.

I think it’s pretty obvious how that vote would end up.

 

[Ashley]

We all agree that football is the people's game and it belongs to us and I don't think anyone would dispute it. Therefore every season card holder of every club should be given a vote as to whether they want VAR or not.

They're all happy to parrot the message about the game belonging to us so let's see if they would actually allow the fans and the ones this affects to have the say from a message they repeat.

Put FFP/PSR to the vote while we're at it too.

Of course, they won't like the answers that season card holders of non-Sky Sports Six clubs will give them..

 

[Rubics]

If it’s obvious why do we have to put up with it? Sky want it for content, tourist clubs want it to protect themselves, but the fans can’t stand it. What other industry ignores what it’s “customers” wants?

 

[Rubics]

They also keep trotting out that the number of correct decisions has increased dramatically through VAR. Really - that’s not what the fans think. Reffing has never been so bad.

 

[Listen 'ere young man]

Why does everyone take the default position that there isn't any corruption in this country?

Wherever money is involved, you can never rule it out.

 

[Strummer]

If the PGMOL won’t release the audio publicly, Forest should ask for a written transcript, then take a leaf out of the BBC from the 1980s/90s when the government banned Sinn Fein MPs Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinness from being interviewed on the telly, the Beeb decided to show the footage, but have actors over-dub the voices, and there was nothing the government could do about that.

Forest could spice it up a bit by getting some celebs in to do the voiceovers.

 

[I'm Red Till Dead]

I think it’s pretty obvious how that vote would end up.

87.88% in support of VAR, The Premier League and PGMOL according to those counting the votes at the Premier League offices, I imagine

 

[Mr. Blonde]

If the PGMOL won’t release the audio publicly, Forest should ask for a written transcript, then take a leaf out of the BBC from the 1980s/90s when the government banned Sinn Fein MPs Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinness from being interviewed on the telly, the Beeb decided to show the footage, but have actors over-dub the voices, and there was nothing the government could do about that.

Forest could spice it up a bit by getting some celebs in to do the voiceovers.

Su Pollard as Stuart Attwell would be entertaining!

 

[Listen 'ere young man]

I can understand the incompetence line if it was truly random, when the big boys get the micro analysis and the "smaller" clubs just a "it's been checked and cleared" line by the commie you can't help but think something fishy is afoot.

There is so much subjectivity in VAR you can taylor many decisions one way or the other.

You could even have an AI algorithm automatically draw those lines a fraction of a millimeter either side to change the decision on the press of a button.

Hope there is a proper investigation over how all these decisions come to be after this.

The CHO penalty even pushes the incompetent boundary, the referee thought he got the ball, which he didn't do surely that's a clear and obvious error, referral at least no?

 

[Tricky Tourist]

Also impossible to quantify the effect on player morale.

I think this is such an important and generally overlooked point. Players aren't machines, and we've seen repeatedly how susceptible our PL squad has been when adversity happens. We also know there is often a flow that happens in games, a period where everyone is locked in and focused, and often that is when goals are scored. Having major decisions go against us in almost every game - and let's not forget all of the myriad "smaller" decisions against us in literally every game - invariably creates a negative mentality on the field. One might argue that professionals should be able to conjure the mental strength to remain unaffected by the incessant unjust decisions, but I don't think that's reasonable, or realistic. We'll never be able to accurately measure the degree to which bad/bent refereeing affects performance, but I think the results since the new year are evidence enough that Forest players have been handicapped in pretty much every match by the actions (and inactions) of the officials.

 

[Flaggers]

Why does everyone take the default position that there isn't any corruption in this country?

Wherever money is involved, you can never rule it out.

I don't and never have.

If the PGMOL won’t release the audio publicly, Forest should ask for a written transcript, then take a leaf out of the BBC from the 1980s/90s when the government banned Sinn Fein MPs Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinness from being interviewed on the telly, the Beeb decided to show the footage, but have actors over-dub the voices, and there was nothing the government could do about that.

Forest could spice it up a bit by getting some celebs in to do the voiceovers.

Su Pollard as Stuart Attwell would be entertaining!

I was thinking more Ray Winstone, or possibly Peter Sellers in his Inspector Clouseau guise

 

[I'm Red Till Dead]

If it’s obvious why do we have to put up with it? Sky want it for content, tourist clubs want it to protect themselves, but the fans can’t stand it. What other industry ignores what it’s “customers” wants?

Sky and the other media outlets must love it as it generates stories content for them and their pundits drawing people in to pages with lots of ads and clicks.

If all the decisions where correct where would be the clicks in that?

 

[Alan Akbah]

Su Pollard as Stuart Attwell would be entertaining!

I suppose there's got to be first time for Su to be entertaining

 

[Tricky Tourist]

Why does everyone take the default position that there isn't any corruption in this country?

Wherever money is involved, you can never rule it out.

Absolutely, it's as though folks are terrified to acknowledge what is staring them in the face.

 

[Listen 'ere young man]

Is there any way of proving the timestamp of the audio, everything is on the table at the moment.

 

[Mr. Blonde]

I suppose there's got to be first time for Su to be entertaining

You mean you're not a fan of You Rang M'Lord?!!?!

 

[Listen 'ere young man]

Absolutely, it's as though folks are terrified to acknowledge what is staring them in the face.

Don't want to get too political but they throw accusations at other countries and regimes like it is gospel whereas we are of course holier than thou.

Err. Have you looked at your colonial past?

 

[valspoodle]

Don't care what the FA or other clubs in the EPL or the EFL think of us. I don't care much for any of them, so that's alright.

 

[Flaggers]

Is there any way of proving the timestamp of the audio, everything is on the table at the moment.

That's why I've advocated for Forest to request tht whole afternoon's recording - much easier for PGMOL to provide, and rather harder to doctor in a hurry

 

[I'm Red Till Dead]

I think this is such an important and generally overlooked point. Players aren't machines, and we've seen repeatedly how susceptible our PL squad has been when adversity happens. We also know there is often a flow that happens in games, a period where everyone is locked in and focused, and often that is when goals are scored. Having major decisions go against us in almost every game - and let's not forget all of the myriad "smaller" decisions against us in literally every game - invariably creates a negative mentality on the field. One might argue that professionals should be able to conjure the mental strength to remain unaffected by the incessant unjust decisions, but I don't think that's reasonable, or realistic. We'll never be able to accurately measure the degree to which bad/bent refereeing affects performance, but I think the results since the new year are evidence enough that Forest have been handicapped in pretty much every match by the actions (and inactions) of the officials.

I said something similar earlier in the thread. For Forest it probably has a compound effect given all the bad calls we've had in the past. Where the first couple of times you might shake it off, by the 5th game it happens you immediately think "Here we go again," paranoia kicks in, player concentration, spirits fall and performances drop. After 8 or 9 games you probably think what's the point!

 

[Cloughie1975]

87.88% in support of VAR, The Premier League and PGMOL according to those counting the votes at the Premier League offices, I imagine

Sounds like a Russian ‘election’.