Financial Fair Play (FFP)

[youreds1986]

At the end of the day if we had won more games, or start winning more games, no-one in the media would give two shits about any of the stuff you listed.

Maybe, maybe not.

But here we are. And we look absolutely pathetic.

 

[Robertson]

Maybe, maybe not.

But here we are. And we look absolutely pathetic.

I would agree we look a poor team at the moment, or at least a bit brittle/toothless at either end of the pitch, but pathetic is a bit harsh.

The off-field stuff i’m more conflicted about. The FFP charge is embarrassing, but we have at least accepted that with dignity for now. Let’s see how the hearing goes. Watch this space.

As for the refereeing stuff, the moaning is getting out of hand, but 20 out of 20 managers in the premier league would probably have reacted just as angrily to the challenge on Neco going relatively unpunished. As Nuno said, it’s not just the result, it’s the safety of his players he has to stick up for.

Is he supposed to button his lip because of what happened the week before? Maybe, because it’s clearly not helping our cause. But on the other hand, f*** that, i’m glad he isn’t a bootlicker.

 

[youreds1986]

I would agree we look a poor team at the moment, or at least a bit brittle/toothless at either end of the pitch, but pathetic is a bit harsh.

The off-field stuff i’m more conflicted about. The FFP charge is embarrassing, but we have at least accepted that with dignity for now. Let’s see how the hearing goes. Watch this space.

As for the refereeing stuff, the moaning is getting out of hand, but 20 out of 20 managers in the premier league would probably have reacted just as angrily to the challenge on Neco going relatively unpunished. As Nuno said, it’s not just the result, it’s the safety of his players he has to stick up for.

Is he supposed to button his lip because of what happened the week before? Maybe, because it’s clearly not helping our cause. But on the other hand, f*** that, i’m glad he isn’t a bootlicker.

I think we are broadly on the same page.

I can take Nuno having a pop about refereeing decisions. But wheeling that prick Clattenburg out to fight our battles is just embarrassing and we really have entered into a victim mentality.

I also have less sympathy with the owners around the FFP charges. FFP is a nonsense but we knew the rules. It's not difficult to keep to a budget. If a points deduction relegates us we should be storming the f***ing board room.

It's so frustrating that we are pissing our promotion up the wall by allowing EMs ego and recklessness to run wild and creating chaos. I get he has pumped money in, but that doesnt excuse the catalogue of errors that we are making.

 

[UnFrustratedRed]

Profit and Sustainability is a big bowl full of bollocks designed to keep upstarts like us Newcastle and Villa, who have lots of money, from threatening the entitled f***ing established elite in the Prem.

 

[Browser79]

All this chat about how we look and how we could and should have been perceived. None of this used to matter. Premier league is now so heavily influenced by media and narrative (as the world is now with 24 hour news making ad money and dividing communities). I don’t think the club or us fans have been prepared for it, and so we’ve not always reacted the right way when it’s gone sour. Somehow Wolves managed to navigate the spate of poor decisions they had early in the season with enough skill to raise awareness, attract a sympathetic narrative and get to calmer waters. We need to learn how to play this game better.

What fucks me off is it’s arguably as important as the real game.

 

[Notcher]

I think we are broadly on the same page.

I can take Nuno having a pop about refereeing decisions. But wheeling that prick Clattenburg out to fight our battles is just embarrassing and we really have entered into a victim mentality.

I also have less sympathy with the owners around the FFP charges. FFP is a nonsense but we knew the rules. It's not difficult to keep to a budget. If a points deduction relegates us we should be storming the f***ing board room.

It's so frustrating that we are pissing our promotion up the wall by allowing EMs ego and recklessness to run wild and creating chaos. I get he has pumped money in, but that doesnt excuse the catalogue of errors that we are making.

OK so here's a question. Would you have taken the additional £15M for Johnson or not?

 

[congo_red_49]

All this chat about how we look and how we could and should have been perceived. None of this used to matter. Premier league is now so heavily influenced by media and narrative (as the world is now with 24 hour news making ad money and dividing communities). I don’t think the club or us fans have been prepared for it, and so we’ve not always reacted the right way when it’s gone sour. Somehow Wolves managed to navigate the spate of poor decisions they had early in the season with enough skill to raise awareness, attract a sympathetic narrative and get to calmer waters. We need to learn how to play this game better.

What fucks me off is it’s arguably as important as the real game.

Perception is reality.

 

[Rockabilly]

A nice bit of Francis Albert Sinatra, there Walter.

 

[Stocky Red]

That's the hope.

The best optimistic view would be to say that Everton broke the rules for 3 years and got 3 seasons of advatange.

We broke the rules for 3 months and had 1 season of advantage.

That's my prayer for Friday morning

You could argue we only had 1 month of advantage (playing BJ through Sept)

The £47M being wrapped up in a 3 year rolling compliance window

 

[Robertson]

The stuff with Clattenberg pisses me off. Like how much have we actually heard from him? And how much is it the media filling columns about how Forest should get back in their box? Obviously a misjudgment on our part to hire a 'celeb' for the role, but the vast majority of hot air surrounding us appointing a refereeing consultant comes from outside the club. If Brentford had hired some random from Denmark to do exactly the same thing they'd be hailed as visionaries. Truth as ever is somewhere in the middle.

 

[WallyBazoom]

A nice bit of Francis Albert Sinatra, there Walter.

Certainly is, Rocka.

There are, of course, many other songs about the wind that would have answered the question of our Bristolian friend but any chance to get a bit of Owd Blue Eyes on, I'll take it.

 

[youreds1986]

OK so here's a question. Would you have taken the additional £15M for Johnson or not?

I wouldn't have been in the position where everything relied on selling a player at the start of the window.

 

[Stocky Red]

OK so here's a question. Would you have taken the additional £15M for Johnson or not?

I suspect when the owners made the decision to delay the sale (before Everton got hit by 10 points), it was a simple decision

I suspect if they had their time again they would have sold at £30M

 

[Rockabilly]

Certainly is, Rocka.

There are, of course, many other songs about the wind that would have answered the question of our Bristolian friend but any chance to get a bit of Owd Blue Eyes on, I'll take it.

Oh aye...

 

[MC Plantpot]

Add to that the possible departure from the WFCG to what will like as not be a soulless, half empty flat-pack stadium, plonked down in Nowhere Town. All history torn up and forgotten, and a Club run by a rich, foreign egomaniac, until he gets fed up, finds a new toy, and leaves us to fester.
Has the future ever been more dystopian?

The irony of course, according to Simon Jordan anyway, is FFP is there to protect clubs from owners who might get fed up and leave their club to fester.

 

[Annesleyred]

Scrap FFP and every club in a business these days so if your business goes broke or owes the Taxman tough. I disagree with how people who don't run a club tell you how its supposed to be done. Football is more than just a business (but not to them )

 

[youreds1986]

The stuff with Clattenberg pisses me off. Like how much have we actually heard from him? And how much is it the media filling columns about how Forest should get back in their box? Obviously a misjudgment on our part to hire a 'celeb' for the role, but the vast majority of hot air surrounding us appointing a refereeing consultant comes from outside the club. If Brentford had hired some random from Denmark to do exactly the same thing they'd be hailed as visionaries. Truth as ever is somewhere in the middle.

But why isnt someone at the club saying 'Clattenburg? Really?'

Or, if so, why is noone listening?

I'm all for the club bringing people in and speaking directly to the referee association/PL. But the hoopla and circus that follows Clattenburg, of Gladiators fame, just makes us look ridiculous but also (more importantly) distracts from matters on the pitch and creates a victim culture throughout the club.

 

[congo_red_49]

But why isnt someone at the club saying 'Clattenburg? Really?'

Or, if so, why is noone listening?

Because actively questioning Marinakis will probably be a pretty quick way of finding yourself out the door?

 

[Rockabilly]

So when's D Day then?

Friday, next week or April?

Genuine question.

 

[youreds1986]

Because actively questioning Marinakis will probably be a pretty quick way of finding yourself out the door?

Exactly.

 

[Fitzcarraldo]

OK so here's a question. Would you have taken the additional £15M for Johnson or not?

Depends on the circumstance. You make risk calculations all the time in business. Not many as clear as this one, mind.

If I had a regulatory body with rules and penalties that, if broken could lead to greater costs down the line, and no legally binding agreement that my circumstances would be considered in the final determination, then probably not. Regardless of my lawyers hubris, which is in itself a risk factor.

 

[youreds1986]

Depends on the circumstance. You make risk calculations all the time in business. Not many as clear as this one, mind.

If I had a regulatory body with rules and penalties that, if broken could lead to greater costs down the line, and no legally binding agreement that my circumstances would be considered in the final determination, then probably not. Regardless of my lawyers hubris, which is in itself a risk factor.

This

But again the key thing is that it shouldn't have been a choice they had to make. If they had an eye on the finances before that time, it wouldn't have been critical to have to sell Johnson at the start of a transfer window.

It's either reckless, or incompetent.

 

[Robertson]

But why isnt someone at the club saying 'Clattenburg? Really?'

Or, if so, why is noone listening?

I'm all for the club bringing people in and speaking directly to the referee association/PL. But the hoopla and circus that follows Clattenburg, of Gladiators fame, just makes us look ridiculous but also (more importantly) distracts from matters on the pitch and creates a victim culture throughout the club.

I dunnno, maybe they thought he was the most knowledgeable and experienced ex-Premier League ref out there and available, so would do a decent job. At whatever it is he is supposed to be doing. As I said, obviously this was a bit naive given his current profile, and don't I think he's adding much if any value at the moment, but sorry, I just can't bring myself to care what the Daily Mail says about it all.

My favorite comment on the Clattenburg appointment came from Mike Dean on Sky, along the lines of "I've no idea what he's supposed to be doing there". Yeah mate, imagine someone paying an ex-referee to comment and offer some professional insight on refereeing decisions, whatever next? Serious lack of self awareness from some of these clowns.

 

[Fitzcarraldo]

This

But again the key thing is that it shouldn't have been a choice they had to make. If they had an eye on the finances before that time, it wouldn't have been critical to have to sell Johnson at the start of a transfer window.

It's either reckless, or incompetent.

Being kind to EM, maybe at the time of the first offer he did sit down with his team and - with sharpened pencils - crunch the numbers. You, know, ran a few scenarios.

Maybe they were bullish from the off and just thought 'f*** it', pointless running the numbers as whatever the outcome they would make a case and lawyer their way through.

Maybe, in this hypothetical, they did go a step further and understood the ramifications of holding for extra cash and the risk of a penalty being a possible points deduction. Granted, they wouldn't have had the Everton example as a benchmark, but surely the possibility had to be in the mix. And, still they just thought 'f*** it'.

Maybe, they considered the possible points deduction a little bit more but though it manageable... absorbable, as next year the team would be top-ten material for sure. Especially, with the positive responses from Elanga, Origi, Sangare and Tavares' agents. Plus, the promise of a fit and firing Chris Wood and some kid from Brazil. So, 'f*** it'.

 

[Timothy Pope]

The irony of course, according to Simon Jordan anyway, is FFP is there to protect clubs from owners who might get fed up and leave their club to fester.

That’s working well for the 2 Sheffield clubs