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Thread: Zian Flemming

  1. #51
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    https://www.voetbalprimeur.nl/nieuws...ansfersom.html

    Flemming makes his feelings known with typical Dutch frankness, and says the price slapped on him by Fortuna "out of proportion", and wants the move to happen.

    Translation:

    Zian Flemming is going nowhere for now. Nottingham Forest has concrete interest, but Fortuna Sittard is digging in its heels with a high asking price.
    Fortuna has the rejected the opening bid from England opening and is bracing itself for a second attempt. Flemming, meanwhile, hopes that the transfer works out.
    "They are asking for a very large transfer sum, a bit out of proportion", he told ESPN. "How high is the bid? Of course I can't divulge that, but in any case it's too high"

    Flemming may get his first foreign experience at the Championship club Nottingham Forest, which last played in the Premier League 22 years ago. He was previously a highly touted Ajax Youth player.
    Following his departure from Ajax, he ended up at Sittard via NEC and PEC Zwolle. Last season, he scored 12 Eredivisie goals


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  3. #52
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by Motty_the_Younger View Post
    https://www.voetbalprimeur.nl/nieuws...ansfersom.html

    Flemming makes his feelings known with typical Dutch frankness, and says the price slapped on him by Fortuna "out of proportion", and wants the move to happen.

    Translation:

    Zian Flemming is going nowhere for now. Nottingham Forest has concrete interest, but Fortuna Sittard is digging in its heels with a high asking price.
    Fortuna has the rejected the opening bid from England opening and is bracing itself for a second attempt. Flemming, meanwhile, hopes that the transfer works out.
    "They are asking for a very large transfer sum, a bit out of proportion", he told ESPN. "How high is the bid? Of course I can't divulge that, but in any case it's too high"

    Flemming may get his first foreign experience at the Championship club Nottingham Forest, which last played in the Premier League 22 years ago. He was previously a highly touted Ajax Youth player.
    Following his departure from Ajax, he ended up at Sittard via NEC and PEC Zwolle. Last season, he scored 12 Eredivisie goals
    Sounds like he might have to pull off that Dutch footballing strategy of going on strike.

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  4. #53
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    interestingly , fortuna has an english left back george cox who is only 23.



    https://www.ifsservices.org/george-cox-fortuna-sittard

    Last edited by marshal99; 05-07-21 at 18:55.

  5. #54
    Nigel Clough
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    1.6m sterling is a bit high in this environment. Cov paid 1m last summer for Gustavo Hamer from the Eredivisie.

    Mind you, Hamer is worth 3 times that now so maybe they know what they are doing.


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  6. #55
    Nigel Clough
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Just got around to watching this fella’s YouTube compilation.

    Strengths:

    Definitely two-footed. He takes free-kicks with his right, so presumably that’s his natural foot, but he actually looks a more clinical finisher with his left.

    Looks calm in the box too. A few of the goals and saves in the video he shows quite good composure to put the keeper or defender on his arse.

    I like the way he seems to run past the forward quite a bit to find himself in striker’s positions. I think this is what we were missing from the central attacking midfield position last season. Hopefully if he signs he can bring this to the team.

    Also he looks to have decent upper body strength and not lacking in confidence. Seems to have a touch of arrogance about him.

    Doubts:

    Sometimes his touch looks a bit awkward/clumsy.

    Quite a few of his goals are a result of Keystone Cops defending or calamitous goalkeeping that the Eredivisie seems to specialise in.

    He shoots a lot from positions where he will be unlikely to score in the Championship, without the aforementioned panto keeping.

    Doesn’t look that quick from the video. I will give him the benefit of the doubt though, as he does go past a few players or cause problems in a foot race, so maybe he moves quicker than he looks in the clips.

    He’s Dutch. They could start an argument in an empty room.

    Overall:

    If we end up getting this lad for around a million, maybe plus a few addons, he would be competing in the same sort of price range as league one players. With that in mind, I reckon it’s worth a punt. He looks decent, good age, wages will be low and he’s just come off the back of a good season. Seems he’s keen to come here too, so yeah, let’s do this one Forest.


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  7. #56
    Viv Anderson
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Obviously this is standard negotiation. Bid low, bid refused; asking price too high, not reached. Talk about it, reach a compromise.


  8. #57

    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by valspoodle View Post
    Obviously this is standard negotiation. Bid low, bid refused; asking price too high, not reached. Talk about it, reach a compromise.
    Which is encouraging considering the speed at which we've previously been eager to throw top dollar at some signings in previous years.

    Call me skeptical, but I somehow doubt Benfica wanted 15-20m for Carvalho originally, and we went in with a bif of 5/6m instead


  9. #58
    Ian Storey-Moore
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming




  10. #59
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by valspoodle View Post
    Obviously this is standard negotiation. Bid low, bid refused; asking price too high, not reached. Talk about it, reach a compromise.
    No its a Forest negotiation. Bid low, don't keep negotiations under wraps- as a result alert anyone else around looking for a CM and if he's good watch him go elsewhere....

    In an environment where clearly every bean counts at this club we need to be sewing up our deals before they hit the press....


  11. #60
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by Alf-engelos Mindminackers View Post
    Which is encouraging considering the speed at which we've previously been eager to throw top dollar at some signings in previous years.

    Call me skeptical, but I somehow doubt Benfica wanted 15-20m for Carvalho originally, and we went in with a bif of 5/6m instead
    Alf-who knows what "top dollar" is for this kid. None of us will have watched him properly and certainly not with a professional eye. I agree we need to get value for money but negotiations that go "public" rarely seem to go well for us because they usually mean that discussions are at an impasse and one of the parties want to flag up availability to the wider world...


  12. #61
    Viv Anderson
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by cheapseats View Post
    No its a Forest negotiation. Bid low, don't keep negotiations under wraps- as a result alert anyone else around looking for a CM and if he's good watch him go elsewhere....

    In an environment where clearly every bean counts at this club we need to be sewing up our deals before they hit the press....
    How does the potential buying club ensure that everything is kept under wraps when there are two other parties with contacts to the media involved in most transfer negotiations?

    As far as I'm aware, there are no examples of targets being revealed under the current ownership.


  13. #62
    Grenville Morris
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by Otis Redd'un View Post
    As far as I'm aware, there are no examples of targets being revealed under the current ownership.
    Not directly but we've known most players were coming before they signed as they were heavily linked. Off the top of my head: McKenna, Garner, Murray, Colback, Arter, Mbe Soh, Taylor, Bachirou, Iannou, Blackett were all talked about on here weeks before they actually signed.

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  14. #63
    Viv Anderson
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by MaxiRobriguez View Post
    Not directly but we've known most players were coming before they signed as they were heavily linked. Off the top of my head: McKenna, Garner, Murray, Colback, Arter, Mbe Soh, Taylor, Bachirou, Iannou, Blackett were all talked about on here weeks before they actually signed.
    You appear to have missed my point that a buying club is generally powerless in trying to prevent genuine targets being leaked to the media by one of the other parties involved, let alone those countless fake links put-out by agents (usually to drum-up interest in their clients) ad/or lazy journalists with column-inches to fill.

    The last time NFFC directly revealed its transfer intentions was when Mark Arthur's ego got the better of him. Surprisingly, even al-Hasawi didn't go that far.

    Certainly since the current owners took over, no deal has been officially acknowledged by the club until the player has done his photo-call after signing.

    Last edited by Otis Redd'un; 06-07-21 at 14:19.

  15. #64
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by Otis Redd'un View Post
    How does the potential buying club ensure that everything is kept under wraps when there are two other parties with contacts to the media involved in most transfer negotiations?

    As far as I'm aware, there are no examples of targets being revealed under the current ownership.
    Of course they can’t, other than to conduct and conclude negotiations to everyone’s satisfaction…


  16. #65
    Viv Anderson
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by cheapseats View Post
    Of course they can’t, other than to conduct and conclude negotiations to everyone’s satisfaction…
    Indeed so, but you agree that stopping other clubs being alerted to our targets is extremely difficult, if not almost impossible.


  17. #66
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by MaxiRobriguez View Post
    Not directly but we've known most players were coming before they signed as they were heavily linked. Off the top of my head: McKenna, Garner, Murray, Colback, Arter, Mbe Soh, Taylor, Bachirou, Iannou, Blackett were all talked about on here weeks before they actually signed.
    I remember the complete opposite. Generally speaking our transfers tend to be sewn up before it hits the press unless there’s some specific reason to pressure either the player or the club to make a deal happen.

    From that list I don’t remember any major press drama around Mbe Soh, Garner, Murray, Blackett, McKenna, Bachirou or Arter. More of a ‘we understand Forest are going to sign x player’ a week or so before it’s announced.


  18. #67
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by Otis Redd'un View Post
    Indeed so, but you agree that stopping other clubs being alerted to our targets is extremely difficult, if not almost impossible.
    Yes of course I agree. But on the other hand, if an approach made, a price agreed and the player has a discussion that's in the ball park of his terms and he wants to come then theres no need to go "public" on it. My feeling is transfer business is far less public, on the whole than it was say 10 years ago...


  19. #68
    Viv Anderson
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    I saw some idiot so-called Forest fans having a pop at the club somewhere online the other day on the sole basis of a report that Kevin Phillips has recommended that Leeds should buy Brennan Johnson and then possibly loan him back because he's not quite ready for the PL yet. How the fuck is the club expected to deal with that type of shit, let alone the rumour-overdrive that inevitably results from it.


  20. #69
    Viv Anderson
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by cheapseats View Post
    .....if an approach made, a price agreed and the player has a discussion that's in the ball park of his terms and he wants to come then theres no need to go "public" on it.
    Forgive me for labouring this, but when, under the current owners, have you seen the club go "public" on a transfer before a player has put-pen-to-paper?


  21. #70
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by Otis Redd'un View Post
    Forgive me for labouring this, but when, under the current owners, have you seen the club go "public" on a transfer before a player has put-pen-to-paper?
    I think we are at crossed purposes (and its a very boring point anyway). What I meant was with a target like this you have a small window to sew up the deal before anyone else gets a sniff, that's it really.


  22. #71
    Nigel Clough
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by cheapseats View Post
    I think we are at crossed purposes (and its a very boring point anyway). What I meant was with a target like this you have a small window to sew up the deal before anyone else gets a sniff, that's it really.
    As soon as an English club approaches a Dutch club for a player, the Dutch club is going to leak it in the hope of starting a bidding war.

    Just like Barnsley’s interest in Paal has gone public, almost certainly from the Dutch end.

    It’s in their interest to let the world know we are interested. There’s nothing Forest can do to stop it.


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  23. #72
    Ian Storey-Moore
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    The selling club don't even have to leak it. Almost certainly it's the agent leaking it for the purpose of getting better personal terms which is always going to bump up the slimeball agents cut.

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  24. #73
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Yes, completely agree, although leaking things to the press might scupper the deal…..


  25. #74
    Viv Anderson
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by cheapseats View Post
    Yes, completely agree, although leaking things to the press might scupper the deal…..
    At the risk of boring you further mate, you implied that Forest are guillty of leaking with your initial comment. If I misinterpreted you, fair enough.

    Quote Originally Posted by cheapseats View Post
    No its a Forest negotiation. Bid low, don't keep negotiations under wraps- as a result alert anyone else around looking for a CM and if he's good watch him go elsewhere....



  26. #75
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    Default Re: Zian Flemming

    Quote Originally Posted by Otis Redd'un View Post
    At the risk of boring you further mate, you implied that Forest are guillty of leaking with your initial comment. If I misinterpreted you, fair enough.
    No that’s not what I meant, or you misinterpreted, either way no problem. It’s a pretty lame issue anyway!


 

 

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