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Thread: Glenn Murray

      
  1. #701
    Nigel Clough
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by MaxiRobriguez View Post
    I remain unconvinced.

    Not concerned about him missing a couple of chances yesterday, it happens, glad he got in the positions to start with.

    But, he literally offers nothing else than possibly grabbing a goal if it's put to him on a plate.

    Lots of posters will say that's all your strikers need to do but the game has evolved and that's not true unless you're a team which absolutely dominates the ball. Forest do not. Our striker needs to do more than finish chances, he needs to have some sort of physical attribute - either dominant in the air or fast to carry a counter, and having a player who can help build up play would be enormously useful for a side that struggles to create chances.

    Don't mind him being here next year, but would be 3rd choice for me. That might mean we need to buy two new strikers if Grabban goes and Taylor wants out.
    Exactly this.

    The only ball you can play in to him is a direct ball straight at him. Anything either side and you might as well forget it. His legs look completely shot. Whether that is poor management by Hughton expecting him to be able to play 90min week in, week out, or his legs have gone, who knows.

    He was brought in because Grabben and Taylor were missing the chances he had last night.


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  3. #702

    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    After playing 20min for Watford all season, he's then played 491 min (5 1/2 full games) for us over 8 games in 4 weeks.

    Is it any wonder he's looking a bit off?

    Murray 'aint the problem. The lack of genuine alternatives is, hence why he's had to play so much in the first place.

    He should be here to start 1 in every 3 or 4 games when needed, with the odd 20 min cameo in between.


  4. #703
    Ian Storey-Moore
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    He missed a few last night, as others have said, if the other strikers were doing the business he would be coming on for 20/30 mins a game when he’s fresh to try Knick a goal rather than having to battle for 90 mins on his own.


  5. #704
    oopsy daisy!
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    It's Grabban at fault for all this. If he wasn't so rubbish Murray wouldn't be missing these chances.


  6. #705
    Bob McKinlay
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Erik View Post
    It's Grabban at fault for all this. If he wasn't so rubbish Murray wouldn't be missing these chances.
    That’s Scooby-Doo villain levels of excuses, right there!

    „I believe in socialism because it seems more humanitarian, rather than every man for himself and 'I'm alright jack' and all those arsehole businessmen with all the loot. I made up my mind from viewing society from that angle. That's where I'm from and there's where I've made my decisions from. That's why I believe in socialism“

    „Don't forget you're alive. 'Cause sometimes when you walk around the city and you're in a bad mood, you can think, hey, wait a minute, we're alive! We don't know what the next second will bring and what a fantastic thing this is. This can get easily forgotten in the routine of life, and that's something I'm trying to bring to my attention at all times. Don't forget you're alive. We're not dead, you know. This is the greatest thing.”

    — Joe Strummer

  7. #706
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Strummer View Post
    That’s Scooby-Doo villain levels of excuses, right there!
    He'd have got away with it too....


  8. #707
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Peredictable really, tons of old man jibes when he signed, so when he bags a brace on debut & generally shows he's a class above in the air & with back to goal, we're looking to shoot him down.

    Missed a gilt edged chance last night & looked out the loop generally, for me that coincides with us only producing in 2/3rds of the pitch with no end product.

    Looks a class act.


  9. #708
    Nigel Clough
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Erik View Post
    It's Grabban at fault for all this. If he wasn't so rubbish Murray wouldn't be missing these chances.
    I thought as much, it is Taylor and Grabben's fault .

    Quote Originally Posted by MASE View Post
    Peredictable really, tons of old man jibes when he signed, so when he bags a brace on debut & generally shows he's a class above in the air & with back to goal, we're looking to shoot him down.

    Missed a gilt edged chance last night & looked out the loop generally, for me that coincides with us only producing in 2/3rds of the pitch with no end product.

    Looks a class act.
    He bagged a brace against the worst team in the league, one of which was a penalty (the first goal was class, I will give him that).

    Since then he has had a goal ruled out for offside against Rotherham and the closet he has been since was the two chances last night. I honestly have no idea what you are watching if you think he is a class act, he doesn't run the channels, his hold up play is ok if the ball is directly in to him, yet to see these movement skills in and around the box he was famed for actually produce anything tangible.

    I honestly hope between now and the end of the season he managed to bag a few goals to win us a few games, but it is looking f**king bleak in the final third of the pitch.


  10. #709
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by MASE View Post

    Missed a gilt edged chance last night & looked out the loop generally, for me that coincides with us only producing in 2/3rds of the pitch with no end product.
    Pretty much sums up our strikeforce for the entire season. Doesn't matter whether that's Grabban, Taylor or now Murray.


  11. #710

    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Just to add a bit of additional perspective, trying to unearth a proper goalscorer, surplus to another clubs requirements in January must be just about impossible. Murray was the best CH could manage and they know each other, how they work and what Murray will bring. To me he looks tired after a run of hard games. Its also true that he is immobile and therefore to get the best out of him we need to play to him with some accuracy. For me, if you are going to go with him as he is now at this age it makes the wider two of the front 3 absolutely crucial-they have to be inside forwards not wingers, they have to get closer to him and they have to take on goalscoring responsibility too. If they do that it will work. If you leave him totally isolated, pump balls down channels and leave him alone against 2 CB's I. the box to win headers, get them on target and find the net I don't think it will work.

    So we have to adapt....


  12. #711
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Alf-engelos Mindminackers View Post
    After playing 20min for Watford all season, he's then played 491 min (5 1/2 full games) for us over 8 games in 4 weeks.

    Is it any wonder he's looking a bit off?

    Murray 'aint the problem. The lack of genuine alternatives is, hence why he's had to play so much in the first place.

    He should be here to start 1 in every 3 or 4 games when needed, with the odd 20 min cameo in between.
    I said, when we signed him, start the games with him and bring him off between 45 and 60 minutes.
    He has played full games, and when he has been subbed off it has been 70th to 80th minute.
    At 37 the spirit may be willing, but the flesh is weak.
    He may well keep himself fit, but his reflexes, his joints, his muscles and even his footballing brain are in decline.
    I would now like to see a change in plan for him... back to what I suggested but which hasn't been followed.
    Alternatively start Taylor, but with the teams we are facing over the next few games he has about as much chance of impressing as an ice cream in a curry factory.


  13. #712
    Nigel Clough
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by cheapseats View Post
    Just to add a bit of additional perspective, trying to unearth a proper goalscorer, surplus to another clubs requirements in January must be just about impossible. Murray was the best CH could manage and they know each other, how they work and what Murray will bring. To me he looks tired after a run of hard games. Its also true that he is immobile and therefore to get the best out of him we need to play to him with some accuracy. For me, if you are going to go with him as he is now at this age it makes the wider two of the front 3 absolutely crucial-they have to be inside forwards not wingers, they have to get closer to him and they have to take on goalscoring responsibility too. If they do that it will work. If you leave him totally isolated, pump balls down channels and leave him alone against 2 CB's I. the box to win headers, get them on target and find the net I don't think it will work.

    So we have to adapt....
    Marinakis should offer Folarin Balogun at Arsenal a contract via Olympiakos and then loan him straight to Forest to avoid the tribunal fee.

    Think of it as payback for the 2m we gave them for Jenkinson.


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  14. #713
    Viv Anderson
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    What I am most upset with was his missed chances because thats the point of his game. He has never been mobile but what he did have is pure finishing acumen. This is why you need mobility round him and the aim is to get as many crosses in as possible for Murray to attack.

    He had chances last night which is his forte thats Murrays bread and butter but he lacked quality. Give it time see if he will improve I say but no doubt he has to show more quality.


  15. #714

    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Let's face it he was only supposed to be back up for the two first choice strikers but due to circumstances he's playing more than anticipated and suffering because of it. I trust the manager and he's aware as we all are that a goal scorer is top priority in summer.


  16. #715
    Viv Anderson
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by duncanmckenzie View Post
    Let's face it he was only supposed to be back up for the two first choice strikers but due to circumstances he's playing more than anticipated and suffering because of it. I trust the manager and he's aware as we all are that a goal scorer is top priority in summer.
    Maybe the manager isnt coaching the players to be better either? God knows only Forest can have 2 strikers last season who were in Englands top 10 for goals per minute and Glenn Murray who is a Championship goalscorer and just not look like scoring its so frustrating.

    Id give Taylor a start now, he hasnt had many and I think he needs that chance to get into form. Last night the system killed the team and no one played well I wouldnt blame Taylor. It would have been interesting to see if Taylor would have put away those Murray chances.


  17. #716

    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by EmmersonForest4 View Post
    This is why you need mobility round him and the aim is to get as many crosses in as possible for Murray to attack.
    And that's the point, the other 2 in the front three need to be getting central and providing more goal threat. A totally isolated, slow target man is rarely prolific, for him to score there has to be a quality ball into the box, he has to outmanoeuvre and out jump 2 CB's and get the ball on target. A much more realistic prospect is a knock down in the box for someone else to latch on to be that one of the other front 3 or a midfielder. None of them do that!. Commentator yesterday was creaming his pants at our "wingers" having chalk on their boots and completely ignoring the fact there was minimal threat from said crosses precisely because they are stuck on the touch line and theres only 1 ancient old crock in the area!.
    The whole team needs to start taking scoring a bit. more seriously!


  18. #717
    Viv Anderson
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    In the summer we really have to take a chance on a young fit strong goalscorer from lower down the leagues.

    It might not pay off, but it doesn't have to be expensive and none of the older experienced goalscorers have worked, so we won't be losing anything.

    Of course, it's not the only problem we have in front of goal. None of the others are scoring with any regularity either, or even looking like scoring full stop.


  19. #718

    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    ...And in a way that's why I'm not convinced by Knockers. Don't get me wrong I love watching him play but in the system we are running we really don't need a "winger" what we need is an inside forward-someone who can do the work on the outside but also is looking to work off the 9 and score 10-15 goals a season. I don't see Knockers in that role. In the system we are playing the width should come from the fullback, which in fairness is exactly what Lolley and Cash did last year. Joe cutting in and hitting 'em meant he was, in effect an inside forward, even if his goals came from longer strikes rather than closer in.
    The way we are playing at the moment is almost designed to make Murray look shite when in fact the players around him need to be doing far more.


  20. #719
    Nigel Clough
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Cash being a winger helped with that of course, In Lolley, Knockaert and Ameobi we have 3 left footed wingers so unless the boy plays every game on the right (when he's also been deployed as an inverted winger) we always have to play one inverted and one on their natural foot.

    All of them are pretty one-footed as well so don't have the double option of being able to cut into their stronger foot and stay outside with the other.

    So there's an increased reliance on the crossing ability of Ribeiro, Bong, Christie etc and defensively it's easier to show an inverted winger onto their weaker foot than to stop a winger playing on their natural side from crossing.

    Never been sold by the idea.


  21. #720
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Crazy isn't it that players aren't completely faultless in this absolute Dogshit league?


  22. #721
    Ian Storey-Moore
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos View Post
    Crazy isn't it that players aren't completely faultless in this absolute Dogshit league?
    I'd open with that

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  23. #722
    Viv Anderson
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by cheapseats View Post
    ...And in a way that's why I'm not convinced by Knockers. Don't get me wrong I love watching him play but in the system we are running we really don't need a "winger" what we need is an inside forward-someone who can do the work on the outside but also is looking to work off the 9 and score 10-15 goals a season. I don't see Knockers in that role. In the system we are playing the width should come from the fullback, which in fairness is exactly what Lolley and Cash did last year. Joe cutting in and hitting 'em meant he was, in effect an inside forward, even if his goals came from longer strikes rather than closer in.
    The way we are playing at the moment is almost designed to make Murray look shite when in fact the players around him need to be doing far more.
    You are totally correct Cheapseats and I agree completely there is a lack of inside forwards but it’s not just them the full backs aren’t great either which means we struggle as well. Even if Lolley and knockers starting to get in at the back posts we don’t have good enough full backs for it. In a 4231 the attacking numbers are made up of your 4 front men and the 2 full backs. Football is a numbers game at the end of the day and it’s how many you can attack with without compromising the defence as much. Krovi is almost meant to get in the box a bit more.

    However you are totally correct and I agree 100% that the strikers aren’t helped by being so outnumbered in the box. As for Murray though those chances he missed were terrible but he is t helped by the lack of numbers.


  24. #723
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    Default Re: Glenn Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by eugenboppboppbopp View Post
    I'd open with that

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