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Thread: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

      
  1. #11601
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos View Post
    Just so its fun again more than anything Ravi.

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    If you want fun go and play on the swings or go to a fun pub with fun mates. Oh you can't do either at the moment...

    Winning and not losing and climbing up the table is what its all about.

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  3. #11602
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravi View Post
    If you want fun go and play on the swings or go to a fun pub with fun mates. Oh you can't do either at the moment...

    Winning and not losing and climbing up the table is what its all about.
    I know Ravi but it seems the other football I watch away from the Championship is actually enjoyable to see. To the point Mrs C is watching too. I can't even subject myself to a full 90 minutes of cack Championship football at the minute.

    Stick three up front and give me a Montanier 4-3 win any day.

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  4. #11603
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Watch Man City if you want champagne football


  5. #11604
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Rzarecteh View Post
    Watch Man City if you want champagne football
    Just a couple of goals is what I'm after tbh mate, or maybe a few shots and forward passing.

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  6. #11605
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravi View Post
    The problem with the twist or bust approach is we're more likely to lose a run of matches than we are to win them.

    If 'attacking more' led to more wins, every team would play that way. With our squad and our manager in this league, playing the way we are is more likely to lead to wins.
    Again, wasn't suggesting caution to the wind from minute one, just if we're entering final stages of the game drawing then given where we are it makes more sense to try and go for the win than settle for the draw.

    But to address the point you're making and ignoring Forest for a second, then actually yes you can probably make an argument that "attacking more" leads to more wins and better league positions for clubs that adopt that a more adventurous approach. The current top two of Norwich and Brentford are very attack minded, gung-ho type teams, whilst you have more conservative teams like Birmingham and Sheffield Wednesday (and until a couple of games ago, Forest) fighting it out at the bottom. You could argue that's more a causation of squad quality but then QPR and Barnsley both play an open expansive game with, on paper, pretty dire squads and they're doing just fine.

    The same phenomena is repeated in the Premier League. Established teams like Newcastle and Burnley fighting it out at the bottom whilst new to the league Leeds United doing just fine. Both Everton and West Ham have found success by being a little more expansive this year then they have in previous years.

    It makes sense. You get three points for a win and a loss and two points for two draws, so pushing the boat out to try and win a game, even at the risk of losing, will probably yield more points over the course of the season.

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  7. #11606
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos View Post
    I know Ravi but it seems the other football I watch away from the Championship is actually enjoyable to see. To the point Mrs C is watching too. I can't even subject myself to a full 90 minutes of cack Championship football at the minute.

    Stick three up front and give me a Montanier 4-3 win any day.

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    We nearly got relegated!

    If you want entertainment watch Netflix, as they say...

    Championship football isn't the most exciting. Most of the teams are a similar standard, so although it makes the league competitive - 'anybody can beat anybody' - it also makes a lot of the matches very very tight and attritional because the first goal often wins it.

    You should watch Man City mate, or dare I say, Leicester. Two teams who exemplify the beautiful game.


  8. #11607
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravi View Post
    We nearly got relegated!

    If you want entertainment watch Netflix, as they say...

    Championship football isn't the most exciting. Most of the teams are a similar standard, so although it makes the league competitive - 'anybody can beat anybody' - it also makes a lot of the matches very very tight and attritional because the first goal often wins it.

    You should watch Man City mate, or dare I say, Leicester. Two teams who exemplify the beautiful game.
    Shouldn't "enjoyment" be part of it all though? Why should anyone pay good money to watch or experience something they neither enjoy or are entertained by? You may as well lob 30 odd quid in the Trent.

    It's absolutely no surprise that kids are growing up (back off Statto) these days wearing Chelsea/Scum/City/United shirts. The championship is absolute dog shit and Forest are one of the joint longest sides playing in it.

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  9. #11608
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos View Post
    Shouldn't "enjoyment" be part of it all though? Why should anyone pay good money to watch or experience something they neither enjoy or are entertained by? You may as well lob 30 odd quid in the Trent.

    It's absolutely no surprise that kids are growing up (back off Statto) these days wearing Chelsea/Scum/City/United shirts. The championship is absolute dog shit and Forest are one of the joint longest sides playing in it.

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    Difficulty is all the money is hoovered up by the PL. Any players with much talent in this league are quickly bought up by the big boys in the league above.

    Clubs that get parachute payments may be able to keep better players but most other clubs are just trying to make do, and because the prize for promotion is so big it's no wonder most games turn into attritional affairs.

    The Championship is pretty shit, but it's not as shit as League One was.


  10. #11609
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by MaxiRobriguez View Post
    Again, wasn't suggesting caution to the wind from minute one, just if we're entering final stages of the game drawing then given where we are it makes more sense to try and go for the win than settle for the draw.

    But to address the point you're making and ignoring Forest for a second, then actually yes you can probably make an argument that "attacking more" leads to more wins and better league positions for clubs that adopt that a more adventurous approach. The current top two of Norwich and Brentford are very attack minded, gung-ho type teams, whilst you have more conservative teams like Birmingham and Sheffield Wednesday (and until a couple of games ago, Forest) fighting it out at the bottom. You could argue that's more a causation of squad quality but then QPR and Barnsley both play an open expansive game with, on paper, pretty dire squads and they're doing just fine.

    The same phenomena is repeated in the Premier League. Established teams like Newcastle and Burnley fighting it out at the bottom whilst new to the league Leeds United doing just fine. Both Everton and West Ham have found success by being a little more expansive this year then they have in previous years.

    It makes sense. You get three points for a win and a loss and two points for two draws, so pushing the boat out to try and win a game, even at the risk of losing, will probably yield more points over the course of the season.
    Well it isn't football manager. These are real players. Confidence, morale, belief in the manager, teamwork etc are all as important. It's true that on the whole teams with better players can afford to be more expansive.

    To get back to the point, Hughton has his approach, which is now working well. The worst thing he could do is to toss away his consistent and determined approach to gamble on a one in a million dream. That's poor leadership imo. Far better to continue the drive towards mounting a promotion push next season.


  11. #11610
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by MaxiRobriguez View Post
    Difficulty is all the money is hoovered up by the PL. Any players with much talent in this league are quickly bought up by the big boys in the league above.

    Clubs that get parachute payments may be able to keep better players but most other clubs are just trying to make do, and because the prize for promotion is so big it's no wonder most games turn into attritional affairs.

    The Championship is pretty shit, but it's not as shit as League One was.
    I completely agree and it's probably where the extreme Alf and the Extreme Carlos meet in the middle, completely fed up with the money chasing arseholes and would love for football just to be about football again, seeing your chosen team winning 3-2 and nipping down the boozer, or seeing them lose 3-2 but being happy as Larry that they gave it everything in order to win, rather than not lose.

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  12. #11611
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos View Post
    Shouldn't "enjoyment" be part of it all though? Why should anyone pay good money to watch or experience something they neither enjoy or are entertained by? You may as well lob 30 odd quid in the Trent.

    It's absolutely no surprise that kids are growing up (back off Statto) these days wearing Chelsea/Scum/City/United shirts. The championship is absolute dog shit and Forest are one of the joint longest sides playing in it.

    Sent from my SM-A405FN using Tapatalk
    It was always like that. Alot of my mates at school 'supported' Chelsea or Leeds and then Liverpool. Then Forest. Now with TV football the tendency has increased.

    There are plenty of people who follow football clubs who don't actually like the sport itself. Goals aren't the be all and end all. Football is about far more. Ultimately, the one thing most fans agree on is that being successful is the most entertaining part. I suspect you're one of the people who follow football but don't actually enjoy watching it much, which is fine. It is what it is. There's always the snooker...

    Last edited by Ravi; Yesterday at 17:59.

  13. #11612
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Also, the idea that playing more upfront = more attacking. No.

    If so why don't we have 5 upfront again like in the 60s?

    Ruud Hullit explains in his book why one striker can be more attacking than three. Man City play with 0 (zero) upfront. Presumably they never score any goals...


  14. #11613
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    If you think I'm one of the "play 2 up front" brigade you are very mistaken!


  15. #11614
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravi View Post
    It was always like that. Alot of my mates at school 'supported' Chelsea or Leeds and then Liverpool. Then Forest. Now with TV football the tendency has increased.

    There are plenty of people who follow football clubs who don't actually like the sport itself. Goals aren't the be all and end all. Football is about far more. Ultimately, the one thing most fans agree on is that being successful is the most entertaining part. I suspect you're one of the people who follow football but don't actually enjoy watching it much, which is fine. It is what it is. There's always the snooker...
    I do thoroughly enjoy watching football and have done for my whole life, I enjoy talking about it too. I also have an opinion of how I'd like to see it played and how I'd plan for the next 10 years, which at a guess every single person on here does too. Unfortunately my opinion this time round goes against the grain so to speak (it never has before) so it's meeting more objections which I completely expect and will happily chat for hours about.

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  16. #11615
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    If you want to see attacking football, watch the German Bundesliga.

    There isn’t one side that practices any type of „park the bus“ defence; instead, most sides adopt the high-line gegenpressen style, pushing up to attempt to win the ball back, and launching their own attacks.

    Even teams going up against FC Bayern will have a go (granted, it doesn’t often work, but even lowly Arminia Bielefeld were at one point leading the Bavarians 1-3 the week before last; it finished 3-3).

    Of all major leagues, the Bundesliga regularly averages more goals per match than any other European league.

    There were 24 goals scored in last weeks‘ round of nine matches, and 20 the round before, so yeah, if you want goals and fast-paced attacking football, you know where to come.

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  17. #11616
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Strummer View Post
    If you want to see attacking football, watch the German Bundesliga.

    There isn’t one side that practices any type of „park the bus“ defence; instead, most sides adopt the high-line gegenpressen style, pushing up to attempt to win the ball back, and launching their own attacks.

    Even teams going up against FC Bayern will have a go (granted, it doesn’t often work, but even lowly Arminia Bielefeld were at one point leading the Bavarians 1-3 the week before last; it finished 3-3).

    Of all major leagues, the Bundesliga regularly averages more goals per match than any other European league.

    There were 24 goals scored in last weeks‘ round of nine matches, and 20 the round before, so yeah, if you want goals and fast-paced attacking football, you know where to come.
    Well I mean I would never dream of watching the local Bundesliga side beating Bayern Munich in the hope I can watch live Champions League football next year..

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  18. #11617
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Strummer View Post
    If you want to see attacking football, watch the German Bundesliga.

    There isn’t one side that practices any type of „park the bus“ defence; instead, most sides adopt the high-line gegenpressen style, pushing up to attempt to win the ball back, and launching their own attacks.

    Even teams going up against FC Bayern will have a go (granted, it doesn’t often work, but even lowly Arminia Bielefeld were at one point leading the Bavarians 1-3 the week before last; it finished 3-3).

    Of all major leagues, the Bundesliga regularly averages more goals per match than any other European league.

    There were 24 goals scored in last weeks‘ round of nine matches, and 20 the round before, so yeah, if you want goals and fast-paced attacking football, you know where to come.
    In short, move to Germany ja?


  19. #11618
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by MaxiRobriguez View Post
    In short, move to Germany ja?
    Ja, natürlich!


  20. #11619
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos View Post
    Just so its fun again more than anything Ravi.
    I think you have this football thing wrong. It isn't about being fun, it's about not conceding goals and accumulating points as a result of that.

    That is a far more stable and long term sustainable success plan than simply attacking and trying to score more goals than the opposition.


  21. #11620
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos View Post
    I do thoroughly enjoy watching football and have done for my whole life, I enjoy talking about it too. I also have an opinion of how I'd like to see it played and how I'd plan for the next 10 years, which at a guess every single person on here does too. Unfortunately my opinion this time round goes against the grain so to speak (it never has before) so it's meeting more objections which I completely expect and will happily chat for hours about.

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    I was being a bit flippant mate. Where do you think Forest will be in 10 years time?


  22. #11621
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravi View Post
    I was being a bit flippant mate. Where do you think Forest will be in 10 years time?
    I am not a Fortune Teller, but my guess would be the City Ground?


  23. #11622
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Strummer View Post
    I am not a Fortune Teller, but my guess would be the City Ground?
    nanobots rolling in from the Trent...


  24. #11623
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    Default Re: SKYBET CHAMPIONSHIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravi View Post
    I was being a bit flippant mate. Where do you think Forest will be in 10 years time?
    Perhaps where I think they will be and where I would like to see them are 2 different things in ten years Forest will probably be in the championship with Mick McCarthy jnr in charge of a promotion push.

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