Standard of Referees (Sponsored by Steven Reid)

[Erik]

The issue fans have with referees is the incredible amount of inconsistency around decisions that ironically is consistently applied to the benefit of certain teams.

And when we're so regularly on the wrong side of that ledger it is no surprise when integrity starts to be called into question.

There comes a point when what should be a normal distribution curve becomes so distorted away from 'normal' that it can no longer be described that way and is showing a trend which is not neutral.

 

[Malwood]

I actually think the refs are really good nowadays, it's just that the rules/ policies are all wrong. Like the guy above says, it's utterly bonkers that rugby-tackling goes on at every corner but then Murillo is penalised. But it's not because the refs don't see all the holding, it's because PGMOL have decided the policy is not to penalise it.

 

[apondaway]

I actually think the refs are really good nowadays, it's just that the rules/ policies are all wrong. Like the guy above says, it's utterly bonkers that rugby-tackling goes on at every corner but then Murillo is penalised. But it's not because the refs don't see all the holding, it's because PGMOL have decided the policy is not to penalise it.

I thought there was a focus/priority on penalizing holding and such on corners this year - yet I've seen nothing.

 

[kenred64]

I actually think the refs are really good nowadays, it's just that the rules/ policies are all wrong. Like the guy above says, it's utterly bonkers that rugby-tackling goes on at every corner but then Murillo is penalised. But it's not because the refs don't see all the holding, it's because PGMOL have decided the policy is not to penalise it.

I agree that things would be better for referees if the rules were simplified. Handball in the penalty area = penalty, for example. I know it wouldn't please everybody but at least everyone would know the rules. Also, if retrospective punishments for diving and cheating were heavier it might cut down on the acting. Perhaps have a panel including some of these vocal ex pros/pundits to judge if there is a dive. They have played the game, so they would know....apparently It would be good to see the likes of Neville and Carragher have to take some responsibility.

 

[Cloughie1975]

I’ve seen the Murillo incident several times and still can’t see a ‘clear and obvious mistake’ in the original decision.
It can’t be ‘clear and obvious’ if it’s taking the best part of 5 minutes to reverse the on-field standpoint.
VAR is killing the game (certainly as it stands at the moment) and shouldn’t have been utilised in this case
in my view.

 

[adam09]

I thought there was a focus/priority on penalizing holding and such on corners this year - yet I've seen nothing.

Yup they even announced it.

Watch Arsenal at set pieces, their goal v City being a prime example. Two players running with the sole purpose to form a shield so the goalkeeper could not backpedal to reach a cross specifically aimed at the back post where multiple Arsenal players are stationed. I was amazed (or not) that it wasn't pulled up, it was so obvious.

 

[Captain Sinister]

Garry Birtles made a very good point on Forest Focus that the ref didn't call the penalty, VAR did.
Mind you, there was nothing to stop the ref from ignoring VAR.
After all, Michael Oliver did a couple of seasons agon when we played Bournemouth and VAR invited him to check the screen as they thought an incident was a penalty.
Oliver had said no on the pitch.
After watching the video, he still said no.
It hadn't happened before in a match, and I don't think it has happened since.

 

[Strummer]

But common sense can prevail, even after the fact?

In some leagues, anyway.

In last weekend‘s round of matches, against VfL Wolfsburg, Stuttgart midfielder Atakan Karazor was sent off on 83 minutes for a second yellow card. The decision was absolute nonsense, but - as the rules stand today - VAR cannot intervene for decisions involving a second yellow card, even though the result is the same as a straight-red, the player gets first use of the soap.

However, the DFB stepped in today, over-ruling the on-pitch decision as there was clearly no contact, thus revoking the red card, and meaning the VfB captain will be available for next weekend against Hoffenheim.

So, it can work. It just requires the football authorities to have enough gumption to over-rule the on-pitch decision, especially when it’s wrong, and there is video evidence it’s wrong.

VAR should be allowed to view second yellow cards. It’s nonsense that currently, they are not allowed to.

 

[Flaggers]

The price of truth is 50 large....

 

[RedRobbo]

Let’s hope MGW’s language was a little more ‘measured’

 

[GOBIAS]

Let’s hope MGW’s language was a little more ‘measured’

Like you f***ing bald ****!!

 

[Louth Red]

I’ve been actively involved in football without a break for more than sixty five years in many different roles.

I now no longer understand basic but important issues such as handball and offside. I never thought that some rules would apply differently to defenders or attackers such as handball. Most law changes seem to make the game more complicated.

I hoped that the change in leadership of PGMOL might lead to better standards of refereeing but it’s clear that nothing will change.

The balance of decisions in favour of ‘the elite’ is so obvious. Likewise decisions against the clubs which stand up to complain is clear.

Too many players don’t help with the level of cheating such as feigning injury - especially when their team loses possession. Spectators see this every game but referees don’t take action.

The ongoing refereeing problems of lack of consistency within and between games, and from referee to referee, show no evidence of improvement.

On Saturday when Fulham were deliberately breaking up play the referee twice failed to play advantage when Forest were breaking the lines. This shows that some referees do not understand the game. This season I’ve witnessed too many referees getting in the way of players.

On Saturday I’m not blaming the referee for the defeat as we played poorly. However, the referee had a poor game. The previous week at Brighton the referee was poor.

The amount of yellow cards this season is ridiculous - too many when the referee loses control of the game. The totting up procedure will see more suspensions earlier than ever.

Unless and until PGMOL recognise the problems nothing will change. We now have six officials plus technology for every PL game but standards still decline.

Rant over.

 

[GOBIAS]

One strange consequence of the VAR nonsense is this:

Years ago to get a penalty had to be an absolutely definite foul, cheap free kicks would be given in the middle of the park, or an attacker on a defender but in the box there was a higher threshold which I suppose is understandable given it is likely to lead to a goal.

Now in some instances absolutely laughably minor contact is now given as a penalty but isn’t given anywhere else on the pitch.

Obviously it is inconsistent as well, the higher threshold comes and goes as and when it suits.

 

[valspoodle]

Curious that the plan apparently is to allow the game to flow, yet the number of yellow cards seems to be going up.

 

[Ste]

I agree that things would be better for referees if the rules were simplified. Handball in the penalty area = penalty, for example. I know it wouldn't please everybody but at least everyone would know the rules.

For me I'd make it an indirect free-kick if the ball hits the hand anywhere on the pitch. If deemed deliberate then a direct free-kick/penalty.
Simple rule and whilst not a penalty in the box it at least gives the ball back to the attacking team.

 

[kenred64]

For me I'd make it an indirect free-kick if the ball hits the hand anywhere on the pitch. If deemed deliberate then a direct free-kick/penalty.
Simple rule and whilst not a penalty in the box it at least gives the ball back to the attacking team.

Yes, great idea, and an indirect free kick inside the box would be exciting and teams would come up with all sort of new training ground routines.

 

[Notcher]

For me I'd make it an indirect free-kick if the ball hits the hand anywhere on the pitch. If deemed deliberate then a direct free-kick/penalty.
Simple rule and whilst not a penalty in the box it at least gives the ball back to the attacking team.

I've said this for ages. Simplify it by making it handball anything that touches the arm or hand accidental or not. It's not perfect but it completely removes the subjectivity from it.

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[Raymondo Ponte']

Go back to traditional Refs asap.

It will, put diamonds on it.

 

[witneyred]

What I don't understand is the clear and obvious, if it needs video refereees, spending 5 mins on it and then asking a ref to look at a screen for a further 1 -2 minutes it can't be clear and obvious.

 

[GOBIAS]

What I don't understand is the clear and obvious, if it needs video refereees, spending 5 mins on it and then asking a ref to look at a screen for a further 1 -2 minutes it can't be clear and obvious.

That was always my argument with offside. I don’t have an issue with a var official glancing over a goal from a side angle, even paused momentarily as the ball is played, maybe even twice to see if there is a glaring mistake. But if it looks onside it is onside. If you need to draw a line and spend 5 mins to see if his knee is a millimetre offside then it isn’t clear or obvious. So they are obsessed with this clear and obvious but are drawing forensic lines. It really is laughable to be honest.

 

[Listen 'ere young man]

Why does an unintentional foul get punished (Murillo) but an unintentional hand ball doesn't?

It's a complete VARce.

 

[Red Ray's Redlist]

I'm struggling to understand the reasoning behind the way VAR is using level of contact to justify a referral.

For the Elanga penalty claim if he had his feet on the floor I'd agree contact was minimal so not enough force to affect him. But his foot was not grounded, and he was jumping over Bassey so in no way stable. So anyone with a brain would know the threshold for contact that directly creates an impediment reduces accordingly.

It was the same with Reyna vs Everton. His foot was off the floor to control the ball and Young kicks his foot hard enough to stop him controlling it. Clear foul.

Players can't brace themselves for these unexpected contacts if they're not grounded. But now the same threshold appears to apply whatever the circumstance. Totally stupid.

 

[MaxiRobriguez]

I'm struggling to understand the reasoning behind the way VAR is using level of contact to justify a referral.

For the Elanga penalty claim if he had his feet on the floor I'd agree contact was minimal so not enough force to affect him. But his foot was not grounded, and he was jumping over Bassey so in no way stable. So anyone with a brain would know the threshold for contact that directly creates an impediment reduces accordingly.

It was the same with Reyna vs Everton. His foot was off the floor to control the ball and Young kicks his foot hard enough to stop him controlling it. Clear foul.

Players can't brace themselves for these unexpected contacts if they're not grounded. But now the same threshold appears to apply whatever the circumstance. Totally stupid.

Checking club badge....

 

[Notcher]

I'm struggling to understand the reasoning behind the way VAR is using level of contact to justify a referral.

For the Elanga penalty claim if he had his feet on the floor I'd agree contact was minimal so not enough force to affect him. But his foot was not grounded, and he was jumping over Bassey so in no way stable. So anyone with a brain would know the threshold for contact that directly creates an impediment reduces accordingly.

It was the same with Reyna vs Everton. His foot was off the floor to control the ball and Young kicks his foot hard enough to stop him controlling it. Clear foul.

Players can't brace themselves for these unexpected contacts if they're not grounded. But now the same threshold appears to apply whatever the circumstance. Totally stupid.

I'll keep on banging this drum like I have done for years now. This comes down to the fact that these refs have never played the game at all or even kicked a ball in anger. You don't even need to have played at any level to understand these things, just as long as you've played. You understand that subtle differences that can have an impact.

They need some ex players in there with them, even if it's from semi pro level it doesn't matter.

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[Notcher]

FFS

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