For those who think we don't need a bigger stadium...

[bicknell]

didn't think of that
but we could always put some defenses up

 

[Kier]

I could be wrong, but I don't think there is much to prevent that land from getting flooded/waterlogged when the river is high.

Surely defences could be built though to prevent it from flooding?

There's no commercial reason to put it there so it's a non-starter. The profits from the houses and other developments will be a large part of the funding for the new ground.

 

[Red Duster]

Forest have trained over there, i saw psycho and co walking back from there to CG in their kit

 

[Forever Forest]

Why ? During our last season in the Prem 98/99 we only sold out the ground once against Man Utd even with a capacity of only 30k

Yeah but we have sold out 4 times this season (Derby, Leicester, Newcastle and Coventry) in the championship - footballs changed.

When Derby were in the Baseball Ground, they used to average around 14k. Once they built PP then they attracted new fans, a new generation of fan if you will, who prefer this new kind of stadium. I know loads of people who didnt go to BBG but prefer the convieniance and comfort of PP. Im sure premiership attendances have gone up every season - partly because of new stadiums and clubs like Sunderland getting 45k every week, did they ever do that a Roker Park? Did they ever sell out at Roker Park? Has Sunderland suddnely got bigger? The same with Derby, In 1985 they averaged 10K, Derby hasnt suddenly trebled in size. Clubs have got wise and started marketing tickets, like any other entertainment industry. Its not a case of turn up on the turnstyles every week. Clubs now employ marketing execs to 'pursade' fans to come to games and offer incentives for buying tickets. Think of clubs who have new stadiums:

Sunderland
Derby
Leicester
Stoke
Cardiff
Swansea
Doncaster
Boro
Southampton
Wigan
Bolton
Man City
Arsenal
Hull

There are probably loads more. Now all these clubs didnt sell out every week prior to moving but id say nearly all of them have a lot bigger attendances than before. I genuinely believe that a new ground would attract new supporters and people will come as they dont want miss out on being part of a new stadium ( i for one would definately buy a season ticket a new ground as i wouldnt want to miss out - I dont have one now). The reasons - two young kids - cant really afford it ( although if we did move Id make sure I got the money together). Mates dont really want to go anymore, although that is changing this season, I also have access to a season ticket via the father in law and get to most games, but if we did move id make sure i had my own!

If we do get a new stadium, then we might 'do a derby' and give away 1000's of free tickets away every week, should we struggle to fill it! A new generation of fan will probably be families - Villa do an offer of two adults and two kids for £40 - a brilliant ploy to get more through the door. Families would be attracted to a new stadium - more comfotable seating - better ammenities - easier access and parking - clean toilets etc etc. Do you think families would have enjoyed going to the old Baseball Bround or Roker Park or Victoria Ground? I dont. Whether you like it or not, professional football isnt what it used to be, its now not a working class mans sport. Forest are miles behind clubs like Sunderland &, Man City and need a new stadium to be able to attract the best players, the bigger crowds and more revenue. There was a thing on Sky Sports New last week going round clubs shops looking for christmas gift ideas - the Premiership Clubs, club shops were like superstores - Forest looks like Netto in comparision. We need new facilities to compete with the big boys. A new and bigger stadium will attract bigger crowds - mark my words :wink: It would make me sick leaving the City Ground for the last time, but im affraid that we will need to, so we can compete. A new stadium is an investment. There would be loads of corporate facilities, entertainment suites that the club could hire out to generate more revenue. Personally i dont like new stadiums, they are lifeless and have no soul, but it is the way football is going im affraid. The stadium could be a venue for gigs, i know PP has hosted the chilli peppers before, it would meet all health and safety measures, good transport links no doubt, enough toilets, loads of food outlets, disabled access. A new stadium would be built to met these requirements.

 

[Ravi]

Yeah but we have sold out 4 times this season (Derby, Leicester, Newcastle and Coventry).

When Derby were in the Baseball Ground, they used to average around 14k. Once they built PP then they attracted new fans, a new generation of fan if you will, who prefer this new kind of stadium. I know loads of people who didnt go to BBG but prefer the convieniance and comfort of PP. Im sure premiership attendances have gone up every season - partly because of new stadiums and clubs like Sunderland getting 45k every week, did they ever do that a Roker Park? Did they ever sell out at Roker Park? Has Sunderland suddnely got bigger? The same with Derby, In 1985 they averaged 10K, Derby hasnt suddenly trebled in size. Clubs have got wise and started marketing tickets, like any other entertainment industry. Its not a case of turn up on the turnstyles every week. Clubs now employ marketing execs to 'pursade' fans to come to games and offer incentives for buying tickets. Think of clubs who have new stadiums:

Sunderland
Derby
Leicester
Stoke
Cardiff
Swansea
Doncaster
Boro
Southampton
Wigan
Bolton
Man City
Arsenal
Hull

There are probably loads more. Now all these clubs didnt sell out every week prior to moving but id say nearly all of them have a lot bigger attendances than before. I genuinely believe that a new ground would attract new supporters and people will come as they dont want miss out on being part of a new stadium ( i for one would definately buy a season ticket a new ground as i wouldnt want to miss out - I dont have one now)

If we do get a new stadium, then we might 'do a derby' and give away 1000's of free tickets away every week, should we struggle to fill it! A new generation of fan will probably families - Villa do an offer of two adults and two kids for £40 - a brilliant ploy to get more through the door. Families would be attracted to a new stadium - more comfotable seating - better ammenities - easier access and parking - clean toilets etc etc. Do you think families would have enjoyed going to the old Baseball Bround or Roker Park or Victoria Ground? I dont. Whether you like it or not, professional football isnt what it used to be, its now not a working class mans sport. Forest are miles behind clubs like Sunderland &, Man City and need a new stadium to be able to attract the best players, the bigger crowds and more revenue. There was a thing on Sky Sports New last week going round clubs shops looking for christmas gift ideas - the Premiership Clubs, club shops were like superstores - Forest looks like Netto in comparision. We need new facilities to compete with the big boys. A new and bigger stadium will attract bigger crowds - mark my words :wink: It would make me sick leaving the City Ground for the last time, but im affraid that we will need to, so we can compete

Superb post. I know a number of fans who dont go to the bigger games because they expect struggling to get a ticket, crammed car parks and jams, and ridiculous queues to get toilet and refreshments.

 

[bradyo]

Cardiff's new stadium was everything I hope forests' will be,lots of parking directly outside away end for away fans, extremely friendly and helpful staff, clean, good services and still retained a good atmosphere, best away ground me and my dad have been to

 

[winnits]

Looks like it's made from lego from the outside.

 

[sydney_red]

Forgive my ignorance but how close to the river is the proposed new stadium? Is it directly across the river from the Racecourse, Colwick Hall?

 

[winnits]

Which proposed site?

Gamston, not particularly near.

 

[sydney_red]

Yeah the Gamston one; I wasn't sure how far Gamston stretched towards Adbolton these days. When I hear the name Gamston I still think of it as just the old caravan site and a small grocery store !!

 

[nffc_man]

But the question is, will we get into the premiership?

For me if we get there (which I hope we do) we should be looking at more than 45k seats. Then isn't the plan to reduce it to 40k after the world cup?

I would rather if we were to move we were going to move into a much bigger stadium and we were gonna move because we needed more seats. Not because we are trying to get the world cup. Let's face it the world cup games are hardly going to be big. What's the best game we as a city are going to be given? Algeria vs Slovenia? It just seems such a pointless move.

At this moment in time we don't need a new stadium as a club, the only reason these plans are in place are for the sake of a world cup. And then if we were to move to this new stadium and were to get into the premiership is 40k seats really enough? I personally think if we are going to move I would like to see more of a 50k seater stadium which is for the benefit of the club. Not a council and forest plan which is made to just meet world cup criteria!

And you do point out those clubs but you have missed a few. Coventry for example get dreadful attendances apart from when they first moved in have they genuinely filled the stadium they paid millions out for? It is a risk moving and we are not filling the City Ground week in week out yet. A promotion would probabaly do the trick but how long would our premiership reign last? There are lots of questions to answer before a move. And I would much rather the questions were about the club not about the world cup bid.

Why do people always use this as a reason not to get the world cup, this years world cup draw already had the matches that would be played at that ground before each group hand been drawn, E.G - Group A - Team A vs Team B. So who knows who we will get, could be Brazil!

Also I do agree with your points you make, there is no gurantee that we will get more bums on seats and we may end up like coventry and have an empty souless stadium.

I will miss the City Ground, miss the history, miss all the good times.

 

[nffc1991]

Very true, we do not need a stadium at the minute but what about 8 years down the line?

The City Ground is going to need major redevelopment which unfortunatley we would have very little if that funding to finance it. Where as if we are in the position to attain a new stadium which will be heavily financed for and extends our capacity.It does make sense all round.

 

[garrilla]

We also need a museum to display our contribution to the game.

 

[uredsuns]

We also need a museum to display our contribution to the game.

A whistle, shinpad, crossbar and goal net? ???

 

[Erik]

Surely defences could be built though to prevent it from flooding?

It's your money. Do you want to spend millions on flood defences you won't need if you go elsewhwere?

By getting a new stadium wrapped up into the World cup bid, by roping in developers and making it a financially viable option the club gains the base it will need to step forwards again at minimal financial risk enabling them to spend the owners money where we really want to see it spent - on the team.

I don't want to leave the City Ground but I can see and understand the attractions of the current proposals.

It's all arather irrelevent argument anyway. The Chief exec and owner have decided we need to move. We have to accept it. It's their call, not ours.

 

[mouldy]

The reason this move is guranteed is because there is land being provided by the council and I am sure they will put a few quid in the pot for the stadium aswell. That is the whole reason this stadium is being built to be honest which is why Im against it because council influence is bound to affect us at some point. We should only look at a new ground when we need it. We don't need it so we should not be aiming to get a ground of such a small size for a move and as said with the whole council battle we really aren't doing ourselves any favours.

As for the council dispute all I am aware of is that we are on City Council land which is surrounded by County Council land and the ground will end up on some of their land but county council aren't selling. However the new housing plan is essential to the county councils housing target so at some point it's possible they will give in and sell the land to us which is obviously what we and city council are hoping for.

 

[Flaggers]

A new and bigger stadium will attract bigger crowds - mark my words

***

Not at you per se, but since you mention it:

YOU CANNOT SAY THIS BECAUSE YOU CANNOT PROVE IT. HOW MANY MORE TIMES!!!!

Yes, it MIGHT, but you CANNOT say "it will". It just as easily MIGHT NOT. mfg:

The reasons - two young kids - cant really afford it

Mates dont really want to go anymore

Add three new fans, lose three old ones, attendance would be unchanged.....

 

[Werwolfoflondon]

The reason this move is guranteed is because there is land being provided by the council and I am sure they will put a few quid in the pot for the stadium aswell. That is the whole reason this stadium is being built to be honest which is why Im against it because council influence is bound to affect us at some point. We should only look at a new ground when we need it. We don't need it so we should not be aiming to get a ground of such a small size for a move and as said with the whole council battle we really aren't doing ourselves any favours.

As for the council dispute all I am aware of is that we are on City Council land which is surrounded by County Council land and the ground will end up on some of their land but county council aren't selling. However the new housing plan is essential to the county councils housing target so at some point it's possible they will give in and sell the land to us which is obviously what we and city council are hoping for.

Sorry to correct you, but none of land at the proposed site is owned by the City Council. The bulk of it is privately owned, with remainder being the County Council depot at the corner of Bassingfield Lane (which, if the County Hall Tories continue to remain opposed, can be excluded from the plans with minimal effect to the overall project).

 

[Ping_Chow_Chi]

Been wandering around Nottm today, following in the wake of the good lady. When you look at Nottinghams fair city, compared to our bidding rivals, I honestly think the others could not have been in the running.

As a city Nottingham can offer a visitor so much, in such a compact area, leave the center and so many delights for visitors are easy to reach for those on a World Cup holiday. Now just sort out with the authorities and get that Main Stand built.

does anyone know just how big the main stand would have to be to make the city ground 45K?

 

[Flaggers]

We'd need to add 15000 total to the ground, so with the Main Stand at 5000 & odds at the mo, 20,000 would be the number.

However..

We would at that point be able to alter the Bridgford End's drop-roof, and there are options with corner elements of the ground.

Main Stand deepened somewhat, 3-tier, no problem.


Edit - typo - 15000 not 1500....

 

[Kier]

[quote='Sir' Flagman. ]
We'd need to add 1500 total to the ground, so with the Main Stand at 5000 & odds at the mo, 20,000 would be the number.

However..

We would at that point be able to alter the Bridgford End's drop-roof, and there are options with corner elements of the ground.

Main Stand deepened somewhat, 3-tier, no problem.
[/quote]

I'm not sure if the Bridgford End was designed with an extension in mind, it may require partial destruction hiking up costs.

There's no chance of filling in the corner's of the Trent End either; that red steel structure holding the stand up may look nice but has pretty much killed the possibility. A stupid design flaw.

I think at best we would be able to build the Main Stand along the lines of the Brian Clough stand which would take us up to around 35,000 which would be adequate for us.

 

[Ping_Chow_Chi]

But not adequate for the world cup bid, I'm guessing that there isnt any easy way to up the city ground to 45K

I would imagine that the roads etc would have to be alterd as well, it's crowded enough trying to get over trent bridge some match days as it is, let alone with another 10K of fans.

 

[Forever Forest]

[quote='Sir' Flagman. ]
Not at you per se, but since you mention it:

YOU CANNOT SAY THIS BECAUSE YOU CANNOT PROVE IT. HOW MANY MORE TIMES!!!!

Yes, it MIGHT, but you CANNOT say "it will". It just as easily MIGHT NOT. mfg:
Add three new fans, lose three old ones, attendance would be unchanged.....
[/quote]



Look at ALL the clubs i mentioned. They have all seen a rise in attendances since moving into a bigger stadium, even though they didnt fill there old stadiums. Why would we be any different? OK I cant say 100% but id bet my mortgage on it. So if there was a study on it with proper statistical analysis then there would be a positive correlatin between a new stadium and a rise in attendances. So when you say "It just as easily MIGHT NOT", you are wrong, as a new stadium probably (and i say probably as trends are anaylsed by probability) will increase the attendances. The club is owned by an investment banker who would anaylse data like this and also would analyse how a new stadium would benefit the club financially. If he or the other directors thought it would have a negative effect on the club in the long term then they wouldnt have agreed to move. Clubs move to new stadiums to for a number of reasons - attract new fans, provide more seating for current fans, provide a better more spacious arena to watch football, more corporate facilities, better transport links, with everything purpose built, the list goes on.

Quote from: Forever Forest on Today at 00:10
The reasons - two young kids - cant really afford it

Mates dont really want to go anymore
Add three new fans, lose three old ones, attendance would be unchanged.....

Dont understand this comment. I said I have two young kids so cant commit that much time to watch Forest at the minute. Not sure what this add three fans take three away means.

 

[Ken]

Of course no-one cannot 100% prove there won't be a attendance rise on moving towards a new stadium, but if you look whats happened at other clubs think you can be as certain as you could be.

As for the potential threat of losing a few disgruntled fans, good riddance to them if they put the future of the club over over a short bus/tram ride or 15 minutes extra walk. New supporters will take their place.
The move will benefit the club long term financially and we need to plan ahead and not get into a situation like Everton are and thinking 'sh** we need a bigger stadium' and take years to build or not happen. Don't think you can use Coventy and Southampton new stadium debt as an example since they were just badly run anyway, which you could argue we are not.

If we are ever going to be a force in the premiership again we need to improve revenue. Having been in every stand/box over the years, CG just does not stack up now. Arsenal are now generating 3 times the revenue of Everton (£3m vs £1m per game) just from Emirates facilities. Yes admitedly its higher capacity but not the main reason for rise. We need to think where we want to be in 10 years time now, and cheapest way of club financing it is moving rather thn CG re-build.

 

[Shanks]

I genuinely believe we need a bigger stadium (if we get in the Premier league) but not necessarily every week. Therefore, as I have previosuly said let's build one with options. For example, one which is circular rings (like the original Clifton artist impression - really liked that) that can raise and lower? The top tier that overlaps would hold say (10,000) OR if this is too expensive sell the lower tiers first and then cover all of the remaining tiers with the sponsors banners thus making the ground look full?

Thoughts?