Dr. Evangelos Marinakis and Pie Cannons (sponsored by Carlos)

Big Evangelos - IN or OUT?

  • Marinakis IN! - He‘s a billionaire so must know what he’s doing

    Votes: 133 68.6%

  • Marinakis OUT! - The club is a shambles!

    Votes: 15 7.7%

  • Modern Football, eh?

    Votes: 46 23.7%
  • Total voters
    194
StanleyVictorCollywobbles said:
People suggesting we should identify the fans? That’s a bit far. Going after Palace for letting the Banner in is fair game (if pointless and petty IMO) but multi millionaire going after a couple of thick fans for hurty words is absolutely not fair game IMO.
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Alternatively, you could see it as a businessman going after people who slandered his practices with lies to the point where it may have hurt his business.

Just because Marinakis is a big fish and they're little fish doesn't mean that they're free to act however they want and free of repercussions. Said repercussions should only be a big slap on the wrist for those fans, but those fans need educating.
 
StanleyVictorCollywobbles said:
People suggesting we should identify the fans? That’s a bit far. Going after Palace for letting the Banner in is fair game (if pointless and petty IMO) but multi millionaire going after a couple of thick fans for hurty words is absolutely not fair game IMO.
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Not suggesting that at all, just reading the article Trents shared it mentions:

'Second, the “Persons Unknown” defendants. This is standard machinery for suing people you haven’t yet identified, and it is usually followed by applications to compel third parties to identify them. In this case, the obvious third party holding CCTV footage, ticketing data and stewarding records is Crystal Palace itself. Think about what that means: the club could find itself under a court order to hand over the identities of its own supporters to the owner they blame for their European demotion. If that application comes, it will detonate across every supporter group in England.'

I was just curious how Palace will go about that process.
 
Alf-engelos Mindminackers said:
Alternatively, you could see it as a businessman going after people who slandered his practices with lies to the point where it may have hurt his business.

Just because Marinakis is a big fish and they're little fish doesn't mean that they're free to act however they want and free of repercussions. Said repercussions should only be a big slap on the wrist for those fans, but those fans need educating.
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Absolutely, if I ran onto the pitch and verbally confronted a player I'd expect the punishment it deserves. Being too thick to realise what you're doing with that banner is no excuse.
 
StanleyVictorCollywobbles said:
People suggesting we should identify the fans? That’s a bit far. Going after Palace for letting the Banner in is fair game (if pointless and petty IMO) but multi millionaire going after a couple of thick fans for hurty words is absolutely not fair game IMO.
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He's not claiming 'hurty words' though.

He's claiming defamation of character.
 
Carlos said:
What flavour pies are we wanting in the cannons for first game back everyone?
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Custard, and to be aimed at the away fans... ...
 
I'll be passing this feed back to EM and see what we can do, we trialed the chicken bhalti pie cannon but all they did was break to bits and give everyone 2nd degree burns
 
Erik said:
He's not claiming 'hurty words' though.

He's claiming defamation of character.
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Definitely think a lot of people underestimate the seriousness of the “non” allegations on the banner. If it just said “thanks for getting us kicked out the Europa League you fat w**ker” or something along those lines they could brush it off as banter. (Not that he even did that of course but never mind).
 
nffcjoe said:
Not suggesting that at all, just reading the article Trents shared it mentions:

'Second, the “Persons Unknown” defendants. This is standard machinery for suing people you haven’t yet identified, and it is usually followed by applications to compel third parties to identify them. In this case, the obvious third party holding CCTV footage, ticketing data and stewarding records is Crystal Palace itself. Think about what that means: the club could find itself under a court order to hand over the identities of its own supporters to the owner they blame for their European demotion. If that application comes, it will detonate across every supporter group in England.'

I was just curious how Palace will go about that process.
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Sorry wasn’t aimed at you, at all.

I have just seen the sentiment expressed in a few places that EM should be, or is, going after a couple of idiot fans.
 
GregorRobertson said:
Definitely think a lot of people underestimate the seriousness of the “non” allegations on the banner. If it just said “thanks for getting us kicked out the Europa League you fat w**ker” or something along those lines they could brush it off as banter. (Not that he even did that of course but never mind).
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Its the 'nudge, nudge, wink, wink' on the banner that sort of makes it worse. As for handing over data of the fans mentioned, I can't remember the case, but, there has been similar in the past where an organisation has been asked to make membership data available to a claimant, but only once the burden of proof regarding the defamation has been met (however, the Court can order that the relevant information be secured and not deleted, as thats an offence in its own way)..
 
StanleyVictorCollywobbles said:
Sorry wasn’t aimed at you, at all.

I have just seen the sentiment expressed in a few places that EM should be, or is, going after a couple of idiot fans.
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"It isn't just "hurty words". They aren't insults - they are accusations, and a depiction of him as a criminal. Huge accusations that were then seen across potentially millions of screens across the globe, all over social media AND picked up by news outlets.

He absolutely has to defend himself.

Fans should be free to protest, but this crossed the line from protest. If they'd just moaned about him sending a letter to UEFA then fair play, but they didn't. They portrayed a ton of extremely serious allegations as being true, with the implication being he was getting away with them, and put them out into the mass media cycle. People will now think those things are true, based on that banner.

Those fans were idiots but knew exactly what they were doing, and what could possibly come back at them. Now it is.
 
Farmer Jack said:
Custard, and to be aimed at the away fans... ...
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The thing is, would you want the sort of custard that becomes non-newtonian, and therefore, more solid, or would you be satisfied if the away fans just ended up looking like the aftermath of a Bonnie Blue shoot?
 
incapable hulk said:
"It isn't just "hurty words". They aren't insults - they are accusations, and a depiction of him as a criminal. Huge accusations that were then seen across potentially millions of screens across the globe, all over social media AND picked up by news outlets.

He absolutely has to defend himself.

Fans should be free to protest, but this crossed the line from protest. If they'd just moaned about him sending a letter to UEFA then fair play, but they didn't. They portrayed a ton of extremely serious allegations as being true, with the implication being he was getting away with them, and put them out into the mass media cycle. People will now think those things are true, based on that banner.

Those fans were idiots but knew exactly what they were doing, and what could possibly come back at them. Now it is.
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It was a shit banner, from some shit fans.

Honestly. This is ridiculous when we start talking about action against the individual fans.

Anyway, I’m out. Worlds gone mad, games gone and too many people think EM can do no wrong.
 
incapable hulk said:
"It isn't just "hurty words". They aren't insults - they are accusations, and a depiction of him as a criminal. Huge accusations that were then seen across potentially millions of screens across the globe, all over social media AND picked up by news outlets.

He absolutely has to defend himself.

Fans should be free to protest, but this crossed the line from protest. If they'd just moaned about him sending a letter to UEFA then fair play, but they didn't. They portrayed a ton of extremely serious allegations as being true, with the implication being he was getting away with them, and put them out into the mass media cycle. People will now think those things are true, based on that banner.

Those fans were idiots but knew exactly what they were doing, and what could possibly come back at them. Now it is.
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The thing is, as you say, its one thing to just moan about his alleged involvement with the UEFA investigations, but, antagonising a man who has taken action previously against accusations of corruption (both here and in Greece), with an apparent doubling down seeming to be coming from some elements of the Palace fanbase, is a very interesting way to go about things.

We've joked about the Big Mans alleged involvements with things on here, but its been with a nudge and a wink. Where these fans messed up, was doing it in front of the TV cameras, knowing that it would potentially be broadcast to billions across the world.
 
StanleyVictorCollywobbles said:
It was a shit banner, from some shit fans.

Honestly. This is ridiculous when we start talking about action against the individual fans.

Anyway, I’m out. Worlds gone mad, games gone and too many people think EM can do no wrong.
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I don't think Forest fans especially, believe that EM can do no wrong, thats a flawed argument. We acknowledge that the man has baggage, and have made reference to it, however, crossing the line between how you talk about it, is something that definitely needs to be discussed.
 
The funniest thing is it all coming out of them blaming EM for their own failed admin around the European competition rules. Try looking in the mirror for a change Palace.

They are so blinkered into thinking Parish's sh*t never stinks and can do no wrong. This could have been completely avoided but they thought they could cross a line and play with fire without getting burned.

They were wrong and only have themselves to blame for the consequences.
 
Marinakis must be confident about this, as it seems odd to bring it back into the public eye after everyone had forgotten about it.

I think the main problem with it from a Palace point of view, is that there is no way that banner will have been able to get into the stadium without some security knowing about it, reading about it online (fan forums etc), or seeing it, prior to it being shown, at least I'd hope so, because if not then fans would be able to get any old message they like into a football stadium, no matter how offensive. I'm not sure the responsibility can fall entirely on the fans who had the banner, you'd think Palace would be largely responsible.
 
StanleyVictorCollywobbles said:
It was a shit banner, from some shit fans.

Honestly. This is ridiculous when we start talking about action against the individual fans.

Anyway, I’m out. Worlds gone mad, games gone and too many people think EM can do no wrong.
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He can do alot of wrong. That's not the point.

The point is some people, not a homogeneous blob of football fans, put a giant banner up accusing him of some pretty unsavoury things across all of his businesses - not just football. It's not purely a football banner. Your view that football fans should be immune from all consequences to anything just because they are football fans is equally ridiculous. These people knew what they were they were doing, they took their time to look these things up and have a banner painted. They aren't just "idiot fans". It was a well thought out and calculated event.

I think the key is what happens the next time, and the time after that? If he lets it slide then how does he stop it in future?

They knew who they were picking a fight with & obviously researched him. So they should have known he would not take this sort of thing.

Not a fan of owners going after fans, but in this scenario I can't see that he's wrong.
 
incapable hulk said:
He can do alot of wrong. That's not the point.

The point is some people, not a homogeneous blob of football fans, put a giant banner up accusing him of some pretty unsavoury things across all of his businesses - not just football. It's not purely a football banner. Your view that football fans should be immune from all consequences to anything just because they are football fans is equally ridiculous. These people knew what they were they were doing, they took their time to look these things up and have a banner painted. They aren't just "idiot fans". It was a well thought out and calculated event.

I think the key is what happens the next time, and the time after that? If he lets it slide then how does he stop it in future?

They knew who they were picking a fight with & obviously researched him. So they should have known he would not take this sort of thing.

Not a fan of owners going after fans, but in this scenario I can't see that he's wrong.
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This is where I think the crux of the matter lies. Football fans, and sporting fans can be quite cutting in the way in which we act. We've seen action taken against fans for 'tragedy chanting', racism, sexism and various other things, including some getting time in custody as a result of their actions. Why should someone be immune because they're holding a banner? As you say, if anything, thats far more premeditated than a lot of the other things I've mentioned. I'm sure if Forest fans displayed some disparaging thing about Steve Parish (or other club owners) and actions which may be illegal, then our own fans would say that we deserve what we get.

At the same time, Marinakis legal team obviously have some belief that they're going to have some success here. I can't see a compensation outcome, but, more, a full apology for actions on all forms of media.
 
Just go on their forum, it’s embarassing

Apparently Parish should hire a private investigator to get dirt on Marinakis in the court case, and apparently Parish has a brilliant record in court cases (a year after he lost one).

It’s barely even tribal at this point, they just repeat blatant lies like they are true. Then again they spent all last summer doing it too. His case should genuinely use their forum as examples. And to emphasise the ridiculousness of this entire thing, he still hasn’t actually done anything!
 
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