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Dane Murphy - ex-CEO

Strummer

Strummer

Socialismo O Muerte!
LTLF Minion
Harvey said:
Don't worry Thomas I'll be dipping in and out to post unfunny memes and get on everyone's nerves
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I will look forward to this.
 
E

EmmersonForest4

Stuart Pearce
Some people used to get mad at me when I mentioned stats but they are part of the holistic recruitment network. It’s not everything but it’s something.

Funny thing today I was debating a United mate of mine at work. I tried to make the point the Glazers biggest fault is not money related putting in or taking out. It’s the complete lack of a plan for getting the best people in the club. I made the point at Forest that Maranakis did all the same rubbish decisions that the glazers did but he actually identified it and did something about it because he cares more about winning.

The way that maranakis moved Vrentzos on and identified Murphy who did a fantastic job at Barnsley was very impressive. The move away from Oly shite signings and Medes to Murphy’s recruitment plan was brilliant. Than the appointment of sorianos was class. I’m so happy that we have a philosophy and plan now.
 
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Statto

Statto

Free Kick Specialist
EmmersonForest4 said:
Some people used to get mad at me when I mentioned stats but they are part of the an holistic recruitment network. It’s not everything but it’s something.

Funny thing today I was debating a United mate of mine at work. I tried to make the point the Glazers biggest fault is not money related putting in or taking out. It’s the complete lack of a plan for getting the best people in the club. I made the point at Forest that Maranakis did all the same rubbish decisions that the glazers did but he actually identified it and did something about it because he cares more about winning.

The way that maranakis moved Vrentzos in and identified Murphy who did a fantastic job at Barnsley was very impressive. The move away from Oly shite signings and Medes to Murphy’s recruitment plan was brilliant. Than the appointment of sorianos was class. I’m so happy that we have a philosophy and plan now.
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They never allowed anyone to take over from Ferguson and run the club like he did, even if it meant having a few years away from winning things whilst he managed it.

Ironically that is what happened by making shit appointments or not giving them enough time.

They could have done it with Moyes, who proved he was a top manager at Everton, and has done a good job at West Ham. But they didn't give him a season, and Ferguson left the club at a time when several key players were coming past their peak, when his usual succession had replacements incoming for them whilst they still had resale value. So there was already a rebuild job needed but they didn't give him time to start it.

Giving van Gaal only 2 good seasons before sacking him? What was that even about? The guy is a process trainer and one of the best in the world. Though he's rarely at jobs for more than 3/4 years anyway, he's spent most of that time at clubs like Ajax, Barca, Bayern, and with the Netherlands side, all of them work the same way due to the Cruijff influence, Utd didn't really have that and he had to build it. Given a year or two more he probably would have.

But no, they replaced him with Jose, who was an opposite approach. Showing a lack of real thinking and long term planning there, they should have gone for someone in the same mould if they didn't want to throw out the LvG approach... But, he's never been a long term appointment either, usually lasts a year or two before he causes some sort of cackfest (usually winning a fair amount before) and so it proved.

Solksjaer was a stooge. He did f*** all at Cardiff and just treaded water there. So after Rangnick basically doing naff all either, they're a bit of a mess.

ETH is the man to sort them out but they need to accept a few years of bottom half finishes whilst he imposes his rule over the club as a worst case scenario. But chances are they won't and he won't last the season again and be replaced with some more short-termism.

It's the same shit we were in for years before going for Cooper, who we need to stand by at all costs.
 
Strummer

Strummer

Socialismo O Muerte!
LTLF Minion
United‘s worst problem is that Ferguson is still there, glowering from the Directors‘ box at many games and he still casts a shadow over the club.

Their fans - and their current owners - also forget he was Manager for nearly four years before actually winning anything, such was the absolute mess of a club he inherited when he took over.

None of those who’ve come after him have been given anything like that time, but that‘s modern football for you.
 
Flaggers

Flaggers

May not be the best moderator on LTLF, but he's...
LTLF Minion
Statto said:
They never allowed anyone to take over from Ferguson and run the club like he did, even if it meant having a few years away from winning things whilst he managed it.

Ironically that is what happened by making shit appointments or not giving them enough time.

They could have done it with Moyes, who proved he was a top manager at Everton, and has done a good job at West Ham. But they didn't give him a season, and Ferguson left the club at a time when several key players were coming past their peak, when his usual succession had replacements incoming for them whilst they still had resale value. So there was already a rebuild job needed but they didn't give him time to start it.

Giving van Gaal only 2 good seasons before sacking him? What was that even about? The guy is a process trainer and one of the best in the world. Though he's rarely at jobs for more than 3/4 years anyway, he's spent most of that time at clubs like Ajax, Barca, Bayern, and with the Netherlands side, all of them work the same way due to the Cruijff influence, Utd didn't really have that and he had to build it. Given a year or two more he probably would have.

But no, they replaced him with Jose, who was an opposite approach. Showing a lack of real thinking and long term planning there, they should have gone for someone in the same mould if they didn't want to throw out the LvG approach... But, he's never been a long term appointment either, usually lasts a year or two before he causes some sort of cackfest (usually winning a fair amount before) and so it proved.

Solksjaer was a stooge. He did f*** all at Cardiff and just treaded water there. So after Rangnick basically doing naff all either, they're a bit of a mess.

ETH is the man to sort them out but they need to accept a few years of bottom half finishes whilst he imposes his rule over the club as a worst case scenario. But chances are they won't and he won't last the season again and be replaced with some more short-termism.

It's the same shit we were in for years before going for Cooper, who we need to stand by at all costs.
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And it's absolutely hilarious and wonderful to watch!
 
Statto

Statto

Free Kick Specialist
Strummer said:
United‘s worst problem is that Ferguson is still there, glowering from the Directors‘ box at many games and he still casts a shadow over the club.

Their fans - and their current owners - also forget he was Manager for nearly four years before actually winning anything, such was the absolute mess of a club he inherited when he took over.

None of those who’ve come after him have been given anything like that time, but that‘s modern football for you.
Click to expand...
Indeed.

It's often quoted that Ferguson was about to be sacked prior to them beating us in the 1990 FA Cup. I don't think he would have been (probably not until the end of the season at the very least), partially because the media loves a fairy tale, but also because there were signs that his approach was starting to turn the corner anyway. The club (as was more common then than now) knew about longer term goals and gave the time for these to be reached. I think also them not having won a great deal for ages before then probably helped them give Ferguson more time as well.

But yes, he joined them in 1986 didn't he? It was 1990 until he won anything and 1993 until the first league title. Admittedly previous managers (how did Big Ron get anywhere near Man Utd?) had left them in an absolute shambles, and Ferguson had decided to opt for an approach where the club would develop its own players and not buy them, which wasn't going to come in straight away anyway, he also had a track record of being successful with Aberdeen (I think he's still the last non-OF manager to win the Scottish league title) and so it was clear he had the right pedigree to do the job but just needed time.

Him hanging over the club is a double edged sword really. It can be like a shadow over the current manager, a reminder of the days when they weren't walloped 4-0 by Brentford and bottom of the league, or it can be there for managers to get help if they need it from someone who basically was the club culture for decades. We haven't sadly had the equivalent with Clough due to him no longer being with us, but we do with others - Frank Clark, who is unquestionably the most successful post-Clough (though Cooper's record is still a work in progress) was at the game at the weekend, then we have the likes of McGovern, Birtles, Laws, etc who are around a lot, none of our other managers count as they hadn't really been successful (I suppose you could put the likes of Bassett and Calderwood who won promotions ahead of the rest, then the likes of Hart and Davies who got play off finishes but they still didn't do anything else) and actually very few of them had been given any time at all.

Frank Clark had 3 seasons and then quit just before Christmas in his 4th.
Dave Bassett had a season of promotion and then quit just after Christmas in the PL (Assuming Psycho was in charge until the end of the previous relegation)
Platt had 2 years
Hart had 2 years then quit the February after
Calderwood had 2 seasons in L1 then was sacked at Christmas
Davies had 2 seasons (plus a half season the year before)
Cooper is just coming up to a year after Hughton and Lamouchi got similar time.
No other manager we have had has lasted as long as the time Ferguson got before winning anything at Utd.
They haven't given any post-SAF manager more than 3 years (Solksjaer from 18-21, LVG 14-16, JM 16-18 are the most) to turn around the situation. But then who does? Managers tend to stay in post because they win things. Even Wenger was getting the odd cup run near the end of his time even if they weren't getting titles. You don't talk about Klopp or Guardiola moving on because they win things. How many PL managers have been in post more than the start of last season? Two seasons ago? Three?
 
Notcher

Notcher

Stuart Pearce
Strummer said:
United‘s worst problem is that Ferguson is still there, glowering from the Directors‘ box at many games and he still casts a shadow over the club.

Their fans - and their current owners - also forget he was Manager for nearly four years before actually winning anything, such was the absolute mess of a club he inherited when he took over.

None of those who’ve come after him have been given anything like that time, but that‘s modern football for you.
Click to expand...
They are suffering a much similar but slow burning demise like we had after Clough. Both ran the club from top to bottom and both clubs relied upon that as the owners and hierarchy were ultimately shit.

United need a complete reset and it will take at least 5 years to get them back. The ownership will need to be up front with the fanbase about that and the sensible ones amongst them will realise and understand it.

Sent using Tapatalk
 
M

MaxiRobriguez

Bob McKinlay
Man Utd's problems are overstated in terms of the complexity.

The short of it is that players like Fred, Shaw, Maguire, Martinez, Rashford, Dalot, McTominay, Elanga, De Beek, Wan-Bissaka etc are simply not on the same level as the players at Man City, Liverpool, Chelsea and now Spurs.

They are a top six team and are finishing top six. The problem is they expect to win the league simply because they're Man United.
 
congo_red_49

congo_red_49

Ale Ape
I love the level of thought and structure he's put into our transfer deals this window.
It's not the basic approach that we see most clubs apply of 'what can we afford today' or 'what can we risk affording tomorrow' or even 'f*** it let's throw money we haven't got at trying to survive and worry about what problems that causes later'.

Instead it's a carefully considered deals with layers of clauses that a triggered by what we can afford if the player achieves goals that directly align to our own. That, and buying players that will have resale or keep values linked to their contract lengths. It's almost like he's Procurement trained on top of everything else...
 
Strummer

Strummer

Socialismo O Muerte!
LTLF Minion
You have to say, the young man has absolutely earned his money this last few months.

In 46 years of following Nottingham Forest, this is the most incredible transfer period I can ever remember.
 
C

cheapseats

Grenville Morris
Statto said:
They never allowed anyone to take over from Ferguson and run the club like he did, even if it meant having a few years away from winning things whilst he managed it.

Ironically that is what happened by making shit appointments or not giving them enough time.

They could have done it with Moyes, who proved he was a top manager at Everton, and has done a good job at West Ham. But they didn't give him a season, and Ferguson left the club at a time when several key players were coming past their peak, when his usual succession had replacements incoming for them whilst they still had resale value. So there was already a rebuild job needed but they didn't give him time to start it.

Giving van Gaal only 2 good seasons before sacking him? What was that even about? The guy is a process trainer and one of the best in the world. Though he's rarely at jobs for more than 3/4 years anyway, he's spent most of that time at clubs like Ajax, Barca, Bayern, and with the Netherlands side, all of them work the same way due to the Cruijff influence, Utd didn't really have that and he had to build it. Given a year or two more he probably would have.

But no, they replaced him with Jose, who was an opposite approach. Showing a lack of real thinking and long term planning there, they should have gone for someone in the same mould if they didn't want to throw out the LvG approach... But, he's never been a long term appointment either, usually lasts a year or two before he causes some sort of cackfest (usually winning a fair amount before) and so it proved.

Solksjaer was a stooge. He did f*** all at Cardiff and just treaded water there. So after Rangnick basically doing naff all either, they're a bit of a mess.

ETH is the man to sort them out but they need to accept a few years of bottom half finishes whilst he imposes his rule over the club as a worst case scenario. But chances are they won't and he won't last the season again and be replaced with some more short-termism.

It's the same shit we were in for years before going for Cooper, who we need to stand by at all costs.
Click to expand...

Aside from the fact I don't give a shit about Manure who are by a country mile (over time) the most conceited, self important, myopic club of all (closely followed by Liverpool), I think the narrative that blames all of this on the owners is a big oversimplification.

The reality is that list of managers has names on it that absolutely should have done better and none of them were "starved" of quality signings or resource. Moyes seemed more interested in playing up to being the heir to the previous gnarled Scottish ship working f***er and strikes me as another titanic ego. Jose had become a total nutcase way before he had come to them-he competes with Roy Keane as the manager who is quickest to alienate the dressing room and then the fans, but for sure he had enough quality in the team to do far better if he'd looked after the basics rather than looking for a scrap with everyone and everything. Solksjaer was a bit of an aberration and an attempt, I think to ingratiate themselves with the Manure faithful. Ragnick-I don't know.

Ten Haag will get them right if hes given time, but I think the dumb assed fans there will drum him out next season if they are not top 3
 
alabamared

alabamared

Stuart Pearce
 
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