Big Lesson for Forest

[onlythetruth]

Hull City:

Work hard to get into Premiership - throw caution to the wind

And two seasons later back in The Championship

£35m plus in debt and £39.3m annual wage bill - with no relegation get out clauses (7th highest wagebill in Premiership apparently)

And you look at their squad and wonder how could all that debt and that wagebill happen

They have already spent £10m of next years parachute money to pay this seasons bills (having taken out a loan against the parachute money)

And now it looks like Brown may have to come back next season as they cannot afford to pay his contract up (just listened to their Chairman on 5 live) apparently Brown was never sacked instead he was just put on "gardening leave"

How not to behave if you get promoted

Thank god we have a transfer panel and some rules - long may that last - Billy would have loved and taken every bit of the Hull backing for sure !!

Great example of showing intent if nothing else

(A friend of mine said well at least they lived the dream for the last two years - it is more like a nightmare if you ask me !)

Two steps forward - Five steps back

 

[Al LeftLion]

Agree totally, but let's get promoted first before we spend too much time worrying about what might happen if we do!

 

[Loughborough_red]

Burnley on the other hand have been very shrewd, and have effectively got themselves a new ground off of a year in the prem.

If we go up, we need to be very careful that we don't over stretch ourselves.

 

[Itsy-bitsy Bonatini Yellow Polkadot Bikini]

Equally, Sheffield Wednesday should be a lesson to us. When they made it back out of League 1 they all thought "never again"...roll the clock forward a few seasons and a complete lack of ambition means they are staring the third tier in the face again.

It's all a balancing act. I certainly would hope we don't take the West Brom/Burnley approach if we do go up, though I suspect we will.

 

[incapable hulk]

Equally, Sheffield Wednesday should be a lesson to us. When they made it back out of League 1 they all thought "never again"...roll the clock forward a few seasons and a complete lack of ambition means they are staring the third tier in the face again.

It's all a balancing act. I certainly would hope we don't take the West Brom/Burnley approach if we do go up, though I suspect we will.

Its a shame for wednesday. They do have the ambition, the problem is they've got massive debts and refuse to get into more and run the risk of administration which should really be applauded.

When they have spent money, its been on rubbish like jeffers whos spent most of his time there in the treatment room raking in huge amounts of cash.

For us if we go up, I dont think we should be looking to model ourselves on other clubs. We've had our own policies in place to get us this far, and if we get up we should be strong enough to stick to those principles.

 

[Barbus]

Would it be so bad to be the new West Brom? One season battling for promotion followed by the next battling relegation, and so on. Life's never dull, better than being Bolton.

Not what the older ones among us are used to from Forest but beats the hell out what we've had for the last few years.

 

[winnits]

I think the West Brom model could be a safe path to take. Stoke have managed to 'stick' in the top flight, it's no unknown.

I'm not going to think about what I think/hope we should do 'til we get through the playoffs.

 

[incapable hulk]

I think the West Brom model could be a safe path to take. Stoke have managed to 'stick' in the top flight, it's no unknown.

Stoke, fulham, bolton, sunderland, man city and wigan are all examples of current prem teams who have all managed to go up and stay there each using completely different methods.

Charlton, reading and newcastle as well, have managed it though obviously not for as long term or as current, whilst wolves and birmingham this year are showing survival can be achieved without breaking the bank (I dont remember these 2 teams blowing huge amounts of money, but please correct me if im wrong there)

Its not impossible for us to stay up, and theres no guaranteed way of doing it. We should just follow our own policies and set our own trend.

 

[RedMark]

Its a shame for wednesday. They do have the ambition, the problem is they've got massive debts and refuse to get into more and run the risk of administration which should really be applauded.

When they have spent money, its been on rubbish like jeffers whos spent most of his time there in the treatment room raking in huge amounts of cash.

It's the right way to run a club, admit when they have made a mistake and work them out, not how Cardiff have done things.

I know of a pro, now retired, who was known for spending time on the bench. To show commitment when he was out for a lenghty spell he only took home a % of his wage. After injury if he went on to compete in 20 games then his wage would be back paid, if he didn't play in 20 games through injury then he lost out.

This was mainly in the later years of his playing career and probably helped secure a contract, but whatever way I still think it's something some clubs should adopt if they struggle financially.

 

[incapable hulk]

See, now thats a professional who cares about his club

I quite like how wednesday have refused to throw caution to the wind, and have decided to at least try and tackle thier debts, by keeping the club sustainable and run within thier means by not blowing huge sums on players or wages.

It will be interesting to see what happens when/if they go down. Will they flog thier players like tudgay and grant, and have to put off the redevelopment of hillsborough?

 

[Jonathan]

I think that should Forest get back into the Premier League, Stoke and West Brom are the sort of clubs that we should model ourselves on.

Don't spend big, instead making sure you have a solid club base and make sure you've brought in the right players. If you go down, you have the infrastructure to go back up. If you survive, you still have a decent squad and more cash to strengthen.

 

[It's Baggio]

It's staggering to think Hull have a £40m+ wage bill (and have spent about £7m on agents fees) when they're only decent player is a crock.

Paul Duffen makes Peter Ridsdale look prudent.

 

[onlythetruth]

I think that should Forest get back into the Premier League, Stoke and West Brom are the sort of clubs that we should model ourselves on.

Don't spend big, instead making sure you have a solid club base and make sure you've brought in the right players. If you go down, you have the infrastructure to go back up. If you survive, you still have a decent squad and more cash to strengthen.

The manager would need to buy into this though - if we do get there and we are prudent if Billy is at the helm you would not want to hear him complaining every other week

 

[BrickTop]

Im sure Doughty will have everything in order if we get into the prem, he seems a very shrewd businessman and someone who is a true Forest fan, i wouldnt be worried about anything if we do go up.

 

[Anatoli]

Billy said that if we did go up, that's the finances sorted for the next five years.

 

[onlythetruth]

It's staggering to think Hull have a £40m+ wage bill (and have spent about £7m on agents fees) when they're only decent player is a crock.

Paul Duffen makes Peter Ridsdale look prudent.

Duffen and Ridsdale both show how easy it is to back your manager when it is not your own money you are spending

 

[SeatPitch]

Worst thing about the Hull situation is that the owner borrowed the money to buy the club from the club - basically loading Hull with debt the moment he took ownership. David Conn's articles on football finance in the Guardian can be heavy reading but hugely insightful.

Burnley have been very clever, especially capping players' weekly wages at £15,000 - compare Bullard at Hull on £45k and no relegation clause - but there's a fine line between taking the money and expecting to go down and giving yourself a fighting chance.

Parachute payments of £15m a year over four years is a huge incentive - simply being promoted will probably see us through to the 2018 World Cup.

 

[sammy the snake]

Yeh lots of points re the debt when attempting to compete in the prem etc

I see no reason why Forest cant give it a whirl though, the important thing is ONLY attempt to complete with the bottom half of the table.

There's absolutely no point attempting to compete with the likes of Manure or the arab boys etc ect. They are bankrolled by benevolent bank managers based on ill-conceived wealth. The EU is onto this and the next few years, dodgy funding will be finished.

So, if you look at the prem table, you need 10 wins and 10 draws to ensure you stay in the prem. Look at the home games against the bottom clubs as winnable, fluke the draws and your there.

Initially Forest have to ensure the City Ground is a Fortress, remove the away fans from the bridgford for a start, also limit away support to an absolute minimum. Don't get me wrong, my arrogance says we must be able to compete with the likes of Man U etc one day, but Forest need to ensure stability first.

I'm sure Doughty wont be going for the win at all costs attitude, so we need to expect relegation on the first season. But, with a bit a luck etc etc it's not a certainty is it.

There's defiantly 2 leagues in the prem, we all know it, the only thing stopping the spilt is TV revenue and marketing

 

[RedMark]

Budget for the bottom 3, anything else is a bonus.

IF we get there.

 

[sedgred]

I can promise you,

that if Forest are promoted, despite the squeals of lack of ambition, why not pay just another cool £1.5 m etc and stop in the Prem, they will continue to shop via the Aquasitions Panel...............Doughty will not allow players to get retirement funds at the clubs expense again, whilst ever he is the owner.

 

[deleted]

I can promise you,

that if Forest are promoted, despite the squeals of lack of ambition, why not pay just another cool £1.5 m etc and stop in the Prem, they will continue to shop via the Aquasitions Panel...............Doughty will not allow players to get retirement funds at the clubs expense again, whilst ever he is the owner.

The Aquasitions Panel ? They'll just buy bunch of divers ...

 

[RICH1977]

good the long term future of nffc is more improtant in the long run.

but even with the above in place we can still stay up next season

 

[Chivalry Augustus]

That is entirely how it should be. The club can be criticised for many things but its evolving, selective transfer policy is not one of them, irrespective of its limitations. Providing any manager with carte blanche is dangerous, as managers are far less answerable to the bankers than anybody else, and can when they've plunged the club into difficulties with their own mismanagement simply walk away. Nowadays it is not just wise but essential that a club be run with financial prudence FIRST in mind. See not just Hull City as an example but also Southend United and Stockport County - clubs who achieved unexpected promotions and found themselves consistently out-reaching themselves as a consequence. Perhaps a very close neighbour of ours shall soon find themselves in that list of disreputable clubs.

 

[winnits]

Whilst any system has room for improvement, I too find myself supportive of our acquisition panel.

 

[earthworm]

The model for Forest has to be Blackburn.