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View Poll Results: Have NFFC done the right thing?

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Thread: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

      
  1. #201

    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Project Zeus View Post

    It's not my argument at all that Forest didn't deserve to spend money on Francis; I was using it to demonstrate the growth in the financial demands in the game.

    What's the difference between Forest spending £1m on a player in 1979 and Man United spending £50m on a player in 2020 if both fees are the same percentage of their annual income?


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    The difference there is Forest could only did that because they were champions of England and in the QF of the European Cup. The issue isn't necessarily the money in football, it's the distribution of it.

    Manchester United can spend 50m on a player when they are at, what is for them in the modern game, rock bottom. They finished 6th last season, it's pretty difficult to take United much lower than that. Moyes only managed to go as low as seventh in a real comedy season. No chance of them even finishing 13th like they did when Ferguson was on the brink.

    So even at their lowest ebb, United can always splash out on a record transfer because of the way domestic and European European comp has been manipulated to pour money into their coffers no matter how shite they perform.

    Somebody has to spend the most money. That ought to be the best team. There's never been any serious argument against a team that drags itself from obscurity to the top through good football and coaching, then being in a position to out bid the other clubs they passed on the way. United, and a handful of other big sides have a permanent place at the table when it comes to bidding for the best players. Clubs outside the cartel have been locked out.

    Even when Leicester made themselves the best in England through football and good management, they were no way near being able to compete with the big six in the transfer market unlike Forest in the late seventies. Instead they lost Mahrez and Kante to clubs who had bought themselves a place at the top table.

    Last edited by Francis Benali (on loan); 11-04-20 at 12:28.

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  3. #202
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    All this talk of ‘they should only earn £x a week’... says who?

    They’re worth the combination of;
    1. The total amount we’re prepared to pay watch the team
    2. TV is prepared to pay to put us on
    3. A rich man is prepared to pay out of his pocket

    If you put on a cap and the sky money was still coming in... where would that money go?

    Just seems a lot of jealousy and envy to me. Generally working class lads who’ve become millionaires cause they’re good at the sport you love. Sticks in the throat a bit ay?

    They’re entertainers. They’re worth whatever people are willing to pay to watch them. Let’s cap Brad Pitt wage too.


  4. #203

    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Carvel View Post
    All this talk of ‘they should only earn £x a week’... says who?

    They’re worth the combination of;
    1. The total amount we’re prepared to pay watch the team
    2. TV is prepared to pay to put us on
    3. A rich man is prepared to pay out of his pocket

    If you put on a cap and the sky money was still coming in... where would that money go?

    Just seems a lot of jealousy and envy to me. Generally working class lads who’ve become millionaires cause they’re good at the sport you love. Sticks in the throat a bit ay?

    They’re entertainers. They’re worth whatever people are willing to pay to watch them. Let’s cap Brad Pitt wage too.
    Our wage bill is 100 and daft% above our income and that excludes other business expenditure.
    They aren't worth it, they're relying on how much a rich man is prepared to risk on the big prize or to satisfy their ego.
    In contrast, my direct contribution to bottom line is 12 times my salary which allows my company to cover the salaries of other none front line staff and make a profit.
    I am worth it.


  5. #204
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Back in my day the players were under a wage cap, the days of the maximum wage. Which was £20 a week which was probably about 4 times the average wage, certainly 4 times my weekly pay cheque. Maybe they got little extras, who knows, but they were much closer to the fans than now, and even top players like the top class Tom Finney went out working in his plumbing business.

    Then the maximum wage went and overnight Johnny Haynes got a reputed £100 a week which took him way out of my league when I was still dreaming of £1,000 a year.

    Since that time players have gradually been drifting away from the fans, but it was not until the turn of this century that they started living in gated communities and shutting themselves away from fans, using bodyguards etc.

    I still follow football and especially my team, but I'm not as invested in the game as I used to be when thinking of the players. I will argue about their playing abilities, but the rest of their lives and characters interest me not, they are nonentities who, mostly, have an exaggerated idea of their own importance.


  6. #205
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Carvel View Post
    All this talk of ‘they should only earn £x a week’... says who?

    They’re worth the combination of;
    1. The total amount we’re prepared to pay watch the team
    2. TV is prepared to pay to put us on
    3. A rich man is prepared to pay out of his pocket

    If you put on a cap and the sky money was still coming in... where would that money go?

    Just seems a lot of jealousy and envy to me. Generally working class lads who’ve become millionaires cause they’re good at the sport you love. Sticks in the throat a bit ay?

    They’re entertainers. They’re worth whatever people are willing to pay to watch them. Let’s cap Brad Pitt wage too.
    Nope, no jealously from me. I'm not really that motivated by money; I'd rather be happy than rich.

    It'd the fact that, as others have alluded, so many clubs find themselves having a wage bill way in excess of their revenue to end up with even just a mediocre squad.

    I honestly don't know if other similar sized businesses routinely operate like this?


  7. #206
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    You can call a cnut a cnut for more reasons than you are jealous.


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  8. #207
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Wes' Organ View Post
    Our wage bill is 100 and daft% above our income and that excludes other business expenditure.
    They aren't worth it, they're relying on how much a rich man is prepared to risk on the big prize or to satisfy their ego.
    In contrast, my direct contribution to bottom line is 12 times my salary which allows my company to cover the salaries of other none front line staff and make a profit.
    I am worth it.
    But they are worth it purely on the fact that someone is willing to pay them that. Basic economics.

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  9. #208

    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Project Zeus View Post
    But they are worth it purely on the fact that someone is willing to pay them that. Basic economics.

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    They aren't worth it if they aren't bringing a reasonable return on investment, they are a burden on the business.


  10. #209
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Wes' Organ View Post
    They aren't worth it if they aren't bringing a reasonable return on investment, they are a burden on the business.
    At which point they're deemed no longer worth it and sold/released.

    We'd all be millionaires if we could only make good investments.

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  11. #210

    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by valspoodle View Post
    Back in my day the players were under a wage cap, the days of the maximum wage. Which was £20 a week which was probably about 4 times the average wage, certainly 4 times my weekly pay cheque. Maybe they got little extras, who knows, but they were much closer to the fans than now, and even top players like the top class Tom Finney went out working in his plumbing business.

    Then the maximum wage went and overnight Johnny Haynes got a reputed £100 a week which took him way out of my league when I was still dreaming of £1,000 a year.

    Since that time players have gradually been drifting away from the fans, but it was not until the turn of this century that they started living in gated communities and shutting themselves away from fans, using bodyguards etc.

    I still follow football and especially my team, but I'm not as invested in the game as I used to be when thinking of the players. I will argue about their playing abilities, but the rest of their lives and characters interest me not, they are nonentities who, mostly, have an exaggerated idea of their own importance.
    I live on an estate that was home to 2 European Cup winners at the time they won the European cup. My brother lived next door to Steve Chettle and I can remember when the bottom of Beechdale Road was a ghetto of Forest players.
    You're earning some dollar if you have similar neighbours now and we area bang average 2nd division team.
    Something doesn't add up.


  12. #211
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Wes' Organ View Post
    I live on an estate that was home to 2 European Cup winners at the time they won the European cup. My brother lived next door to Steve Chettle and I can remember when the bottom of Beechdale Road was a ghetto of Forest players.
    You're earning some dollar if you have similar neighbours now and we area bang average 2nd division team.
    Something doesn't add up.
    I werent that impressed with Lolleys gaff when he threw a pan over his house a month back... looked like a semi in bread and lard island

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  13. #212

    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Project Zeus View Post
    At which point they're deemed no longer worth it and sold/released.

    We'd all be millionaires if we could only make good investments.

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    The fact is that they would all work for half of their current salary if forced and the vast majority would still be massively overpaid.
    I'm hoping that footballers keep up their stance of refusing pay cuts and the public realise that a deferral means they still get there full money leading to change in the salary structure because it is way over the top as it stands.
    Pay the fuckers a massive promotion bonus by all means but it's time to stop rewarding failure.


  14. #213

    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    I werent that impressed with Lolleys gaff when he threw a pan over his house a month back... looked like a semi in bread and lard island

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    Try buying it.


  15. #214
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Wes' Organ View Post
    Try buying it.
    I genuinely wouldnt live up that way for free..... them kind of places are like famous birds who everyone says are fit, and because of that your supposed to agree... fuck that.

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  16. #215

    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    I genuinely wouldnt live up that way for free..... them kind of places are like famous birds who everyone says are fit, and because of that your supposed to agree... fuck that.

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    Me neither but that's not the point I'm making izit bro?


  17. #216
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Wes' Organ View Post
    Me neither but that's not the point I'm making izit bro?
    I have no idea.

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  18. #217

    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    I have no idea.

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    Correct.


  19. #218
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Wes' Organ View Post
    Our wage bill is 100 and daft% above our income and that excludes other business expenditure.
    They aren't worth it, they're relying on how much a rich man is prepared to risk on the big prize or to satisfy their ego.
    In contrast, my direct contribution to bottom line is 12 times my salary which allows my company to cover the salaries of other none front line staff and make a profit.
    I am worth it.
    They are worth it cause someone is paying it. End of. The club doesn’t have to pay that money, but they choose to. No one is making them.


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  20. #219

    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Carvel View Post
    They are worth it cause someone is paying it. End of. The club doesn’t have to pay that money, but they choose to. No one is making them.


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    It doesn't make them worth it.
    I worked in a family business where the bosses lad was earning considerably more than me for a lesser job, doesn't mean he was worth it though.


  21. #220
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Carvel View Post
    They are worth it cause someone is paying it. End of. The club doesn’t have to pay that money, but they choose to. No one is making them.


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    Well the Premier League and agents are forcing clubs to pay that money, when you have players like Colback who are poor premier League players but good to very good championship players earning 60k+ then the average player thinks they're worth at least 20k etc, then teams like Villa come down with an extra 150m to spend and offer stupid wages in the hope of buying promotion so offer stupid wages to every half decent player so that no-one else has a chance. It's a completely unavoidable vicious cycle.

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  22. #221
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by gamble View Post
    Well the Premier League and agents are forcing clubs to pay that money, when you have players like Colback who are poor premier League players but good to very good championship players earning 60k+ then the average player thinks they're worth at least 20k etc, then teams like Villa come down with an extra 150m to spend and offer stupid wages in the hope of buying promotion so offer stupid wages to every half decent player so that no-one else has a chance. It's a completely unavoidable vicious cycle.

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    Point being, football isn’t a supermarket, an energy company, housing etc.

    It’s a game. It’s entertainment. It’s not required in life. Value and worth are completely subjective. I spend £500 on a season ticket. Most people I know think that’s fucking ridiculous and ‘not worth it’.

    I don’t get why people are so bothered about what footballers earn. They’re just young lads, a lot working class, that have managed to breakthrough the class/social structure to be very wealthy. Fair play to them. I don’t understand why people are so desperate to take money off them. Take it off them and what ... keep it in EMs pocket?

    Plenty wealth inequality in the country, I just don’t think footballers deserve the focus they get. If we’re going to get a bit commie about it there are far better targets in a square mile in London’s financial district that are more worthwhile targets.


  23. #222
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Just think.

    If we hadn't have paid some agent a massively over inflated fee for a grossly overvalued player we'd probably have been able to use the money so we didn't have to furlough staff at all.

    But instead, when this is all over, we'll take our money from the government and go back to paying agents grossly over inflated fees for massively overvalued players.

    Meanwhile, we'll all be paying for this shit through increased taxation.


  24. #223
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Erik View Post
    Just think.

    If we hadn't have paid some agent a massively over inflated fee for a grossly overvalued player we'd probably have been able to use the money so we didn't have to furlough staff at all.

    But instead, when this is all over, we'll take our money from the government and go back to paying agents grossly over inflated fees for massively overvalued players.

    Meanwhile, we'll all be paying for this shit through increased taxation.
    I don’t imagine that decision was based on whether EM could afford it or how much players earn. He obviously could afford to pay the staff but just chose not to.


  25. #224
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Carvel View Post
    Point being, football isn’t a supermarket, an energy company, housing etc.

    It’s a game. It’s entertainment. It’s not required in life. Value and worth are completely subjective. I spend £500 on a season ticket. Most people I know think that’s fucking ridiculous and ‘not worth it’.

    I don’t get why people are so bothered about what footballers earn. They’re just young lads, a lot working class, that have managed to breakthrough the class/social structure to be very wealthy. Fair play to them. I don’t understand why people are so desperate to take money off them. Take it off them and what ... keep it in EMs pocket?

    Plenty wealth inequality in the country, I just don’t think footballers deserve the focus they get. If we’re going to get a bit commie about it there are far better targets in a square mile in London’s financial district that are more worthwhile targets.
    Money greed and agents have ruined the game and for every one person that thinks like you do there's 10,000 that utterly disagree.

    I'm glad I'm in the overwhelming majority camp. I hope this is the massive wake up call for the few selfish avaricious bastards


  26. #225
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    Default Re: NFFC to furlough non-playing staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymondo Ponte' View Post
    Money greed and agents have ruined the game and for every one person that thinks like you do there's 10,000 that utterly disagree.

    I'm glad I'm in the overwhelming majority camp. I hope this is the massive wake up call for the few selfish avaricious bastards
    Well I’m glad you’re pleased with yourself.

    I’ve often found most people are fairly disappointing so happy to be in a ‘camp’ of one.

    I wonder how many of those 10,000 still pay the tv money, go to games etc. Great being an armchair moralist I bet.

    Some regulation on agents I can get on board with. But the players are the last ones that should be punished. If clubs don’t want to, or can’t afford to pay them... then don’t ! Really, really easy !

    In all seriousness, of course it’s a shitty greedy game. I’ve not been arguing it isn’t.

    It’s just funny how the population falls right in to place as soon as the government make mention of footballers. Whipped everyone up so all of a sudden the country’s problems are quite clearly and obviously Pogbas fault. Nothing to do with successive governments failing to invest properly in the nhs, no no. It’s the footballers. Now, let’s all go outside and have a little clap shall we.


 

 

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