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Thread: 13 Years on, In The Top One

      
  1. #1
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    Default 13 Years on, In The Top One

    13 Years since Brian Clough passed away.

    A football genius and idiosyncratic manager.

    Never Forgetten.

    We shall meet again before long to march to new triumphs - Giuseppe Garibaldi | vivit post funera virtus - Emprorer Tiberius

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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Wouldn't last 6 months at any modern club. Too much of a none-conformist for the smaller clubs & England as they're obsessed with control, & too "unfashionable" for the big clubs who'd only have Briano Cloughelie there.

    With each passing year I detest society even more that someone like Clough would be shunned not embraced.

    RIP Brian, the top man for a simpler time.

    “All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a Thousand Enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.”

  4. #3
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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    I'd go further Alf in saying that a significant proportion of our modern-day fanbase would have been constantly demanding his removal on the evidence of his record over his first 18-month-or-so.


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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Bit of a hard comparison to make seeing as Clough was the one who brought us the success which everybody since has had to live up to. The club missed the boat (or should that be gravy train) by not establishing ourselves back at top in the mid to late 90s.


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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    The modern sponsors wouldn't touch "Brand Clough" with a bargepole and would force him out of the game for hurting people's feelings and damaging their brands.

    It is more about selling merchandise than playing football now.


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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Quote Originally Posted by adam09 View Post
    Bit of a hard comparison to make seeing as Clough was the one who brought us the success which everybody since has had to live up to. The club missed the boat (or should that be gravy train) by not establishing ourselves back at top in the mid to late 90s.
    I don't think we would have fared any better than Villa, Leeds, Everton or Newcastle even if we hadn't slipped down in the 90s.


  8. #7

    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Clough was a product of his time. Had he been born fifty years later, he'd have been a product of a different time and would have behaved differently. The one timeless quality in his possession was a knowledge of what makes people tick. He'd have been just fine in the modern era.


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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One



    „The revolution will inevitably awaken in the British working class the deepest passions which have been diverted along artificial channels with the aid of football.“

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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Quote Originally Posted by Carayol Camping View Post
    Clough was a product of his time. Had he been born fifty years later, he'd have been a product of a different time and would have behaved differently. The one timeless quality in his possession was a knowledge of what makes people tick. He'd have been just fine in the modern era.
    This. His outstanding man management skills and charisma would have ensured he was a success in any era.

    "Outside the family life, there is nothing better than winning the European Cups." Brian Clough

  11. #10
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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Quote Originally Posted by Carayol Camping View Post
    Clough was a product of his time. Had he been born fifty years later, he'd have been a product of a different time and would have behaved differently. The one timeless quality in his possession was a knowledge of what makes people tick. He'd have been just fine in the modern era.
    I am so sure about that. For one thing a football manager has far less authority over the players now than Cloughie did in the 70s/80s. The players and their agents hold most of the cards these days. Also a major part of Cloughie's power came from rattling the Establishment, which back then was much the last surviving remnants of the pre-war Empire. The Establishment now is a very different animal and far less tolerant of those that question its authority.


  12. #11

    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Juif Rouge View Post
    I am so sure about that. For one thing a football manager has far less authority over the players now than Cloughie did in the 70s/80s. The players and their agents hold most of the cards these days. Also a major part of Cloughie's power came from rattling the Establishment, which back then was much the last surviving remnants of the pre-war Empire. The Establishment now is a very different animal and far less tolerant of those that question its authority.
    Had Napoleon been born in 1969, do you think he would still build his strategy around cavalry charges?


  13. #12

    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Quote Originally Posted by Carayol Camping View Post
    Had Napoleon been born in 1969, do you think he would still build his strategy around cavalry charges?
    It's not about his stratergy, it's about the environment around him which appriciates & gives chance to said stratergy.

    Tbf, he might land a lower league job at a club which is happy to embrace more indepentant & strong willed managers (Clough, not Napoleon). There's just far less around now than there were then.

    There's no doubt that Clough's attitude, and a confident/"arrogant" attitude was definitely also more valued than vilified in past years. It's the same as modern rules on tackling changing the playing environment. Pearce would still play in the modern game but not be as prominant due to how soft it is now.

    Last edited by Alf-ugginblowupyourbakery; 20-09-17 at 12:20.

  14. #13
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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Quote Originally Posted by Carayol Camping View Post
    Had Napoleon been born in 1969, do you think he would still build his strategy around cavalry charges?
    Cloughie built teams around the carrot and stick principle, the stick is no longer available.

    Tanks replaced cavalry, and drones are now replacing tanks, but the strategies of warfare have changed very little since Thermopylae.


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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Quote Originally Posted by adam09 View Post
    Bit of a hard comparison to make seeing as Clough was the one who brought us the success which everybody since has had to live up to. The club missed the boat (or should that be gravy train) by not establishing ourselves back at top in the mid to late 90s.
    Along with Clark out for being passed his best, Gemmill out for being too lightweight, McGovern out,What the fk does he do Burns out,just a clogger etc etc


  16. #15
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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravi View Post
    This. His outstanding man management skills and charisma would have ensured he was a success in any era.
    Whilst I agree totally. He'd need time to do that.

    Success at Forest did not happen overnight and without question if you had dropped Clough into the modern era, by now an element of the Forest fanbase will have been putting forward a case that he had 'lost it' and should be moved on.


  17. #16

    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Juif Rouge View Post
    Tanks replaced cavalry, and drones are now replacing tanks, but the strategies of warfare have changed very little since Thermopylae.
    Exactly. 21st century Napoleon wouldn't use horses, he'd use drones; 21st century Clough wouldn't use carrot-and-stick but something more appropriate. You've made my point for me.


  18. #17
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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    There will never be another like him.
    I'm just happy I got to see him manage.

    Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk


  19. #18
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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Quote Originally Posted by Carayol Camping View Post
    Exactly. 21st century Napoleon wouldn't use horses, he'd use drones; 21st century Clough wouldn't use carrot-and-stick but something more appropriate. You've made my point for me.
    I don't see your military comparison as being anything like similar to the massive changes in football over the last 30 years. The quintessential Clough challenged authority and suffered no fools, but the modern games does not tolerate that. Clough the conformist, politically correct "yes person" would not be Clough.


  20. #19
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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    This thread brings up the question has anybody managed to find an internet based copy of the pre game montage that has appeared this year.

    I know the twats who get there dead on 3 wont have a clue but for those that havent seen it its proper hairs on the back of your neck stuff.


  21. #20
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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    The great man would not last 2 minutes today in this world of liberal snowflakes who complain about everything, twitter would collapse instantly as soon as he opened his mouth. RIP Brian very much missed


  22. #21
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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravi View Post
    This. His outstanding man management skills and charisma would have ensured he was a success in any era.
    I completely agree Ravi. Also, those who say he wouldn't be able to deal with the modern-day millionaire players and their ever-demanding agents totally underestimate the man.

    Had it not been for the alcohol, I'm convinced he would certainly have given Ferguson and Wenger a run-for-their-money for a good few years.

    Last edited by Otis Redd'un; 20-09-17 at 14:05.

  23. #22
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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    I have no opinion on whether he would last in today's game.
    My only opinion is that he was a genius in the one that mattered.
    Thanks for everything Sir Brian.
    RIP.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


  24. #23
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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    The thing about geniuses is they are able to adapt with the times and circumstances and still make it look and sound simple.

    Their key skills are being able to spot things others don't, have people hang on their every word, open their minds to their way of thinking, and get results.

    Brian Clough was one of those magical few. RIP.


  25. #24
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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Quote Originally Posted by Otis Redd'un View Post

    Had it not been for the alcohol, I'm convinced he would certainly have given Ferguson and Wenger a run-for-their-money for a good few years.
    He would have been better.


  26. #25
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    Default Re: 13 Years on, In The Top One

    Stand up and sing for Cloughy the King




 

 

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