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  1. #1
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    Default Going to hell in a handbasket.

    As some of you will be aware I'm one of those weird hippy people who believes that we should be making practical changes to our lifestyles to negate the onset of man made global warming.

    Having just watched this....



    ....it got me thinking about how forum members perceive the threat of man made global warming and what, if anything, we can do about it.

    Do you think we can engineer our way out of the problem, or will we have to reduce our fossil fuelled lifestyle?

    Is it down to politicians to lead us from expected disaster, or will collective people power change the lawmakers hand?

    Do you even believe in climate change, or is it an unproven science created to tax and control us even more?

    My beliefs are firmly nailed to the mast, as most of you will know. Where do you stand?


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  3. #2
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Over population or an asteroid will put an end to us long before global warming.
    Just to cheer everyone up.


  4. #3
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lefkasman View Post
    Over population or an asteroid will put an end to us long before global warming.
    Just to cheer everyone up.
    So you think it is something far off in the future rather than a present day problem?


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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swagman View Post
    So you think it is something far off in the future rather than a present day problem?
    Joking apart, its present day. Maybe its already too late. Everyone seems to point the finger at cars and aeroplane's. The shit that shipping and cruise liners chuck out is massive.
    How we can influence China India and the USA on a big enough scale to make a difference is beyond me.
    But I don't want to hold my hands up and give in.


  6. #5
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Can't watch the vid at the mo but tbh I'm not sure of climate change is anything other than just natural planetary "moods". That said, why take the risk? caring for the planet more certainly aint gunna hurt.

    I think it's really just a case of breeding a more traditional "give a fuck about your community, country and everyone" mentality which used to be more prevelant in modern society than it has been since capitalism became the staple.

    I don't think any modern politicians have the bollocks to lead any society forward in any way, and it's up to every day folk like yourself Swaggers to help encourage this mentality with the everyman.

    A lot of the issues we have is that society has been utterly brainwashed into looking for happiness/solutions from an outside source, when most answers actually lie within. E.g. "I want X object here now! 24 hour delivery service is a must, and any planetary resources it uses up getting the job done are expendable" - nah, just chill out and wait a few more days etc.

    Changing the consumerist, devouring culture that's bred over the past 30-40 years would be the best place to start for me. Planes or ship sailing constantly? Decrease the demand for their cargo by said culture change etc. Far more to it overall of course.

    Last edited by Alf-aSemedoBlueJeans&Chinos; 02-11-16 at 16:00.

  7. #6

    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    I heard it was all a hoax made up by the Chinese in order to make US manufacturing non-competitive.


  8. #7
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alf-ugginblowupyourbakery View Post


    Changing the consumerist, devouring culture that's bred over the past 30-40 years would be the best place to start for me. Planes or ship sailing constantly? Decrease the demand for their cargo by said culture change etc. Far more to it overall of course.
    This. And the next couple of months the madness will start again. Ironically and we all have to live but its when Swaggers is at his busiest .


  9. #8
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    This year people should ask themselves, do I need it or do I want it? That's my yearly excuse for being a tight twat.


  10. #9
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    It's unrealistic to tell people they aren't allowed to buy stuff and travel about. It's also unrealistic to tell the developing world that they aren't allowed to catch up and aspire to the lifestyles we have enjoyed in the West for decades. A lot could be saved by encouraging the sourcing of products and material closer to the point of sale, but you're never going to eradicate things being shipped across the world.

    We have to move away from burning fossil fuel, both for the movement of goods and people and also for the generation of electricity. In the meantime, efficiency has to be sought wherever possible.

    Obviously, ordinary individuals cannot develop new forms of transport and power supply. It's up to governments and big corporations to deliver.

    Last edited by Barbus; 02-11-16 at 16:18.

  11. #10
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Barbus View Post
    It's unrealistic to tell people they aren't allowed to buy stuff and travel about. It's also unrealistic to tell the developing world that they aren't allowed to catch up and aspire to the lifestyles we have enjoyed in the West for decades. A lot could be saved by encouraging the sourcing of products and material closer to the point of sale, but you're never going to eradicate things being shipped across the world.

    We have to move away from burning fossil fuel, both for the movement of goods and people and also for the generation of electricity. In the meantime, efficiency has to be sought wherever possible.

    Obviously, ordinary individuals cannot develop new forms of transport and power supply. It's up to governments and big corporations to deliver.
    That's very true. Its the buying of stuff and it ending up in the bin within a few days that bugs me. And the stuff that doesn't even make off the supermarket shelf and goes straight in the bin.
    Trying to educate people that getting a bigger 4x4 to take the kids to school in because next door got one last year ain't necessary. They could try walking.
    Bloody Greeks won't walk anywhere.


  12. #11
    Billy Davies long lost lovechild.
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Barbus View Post
    It's unrealistic to tell people they aren't allowed to buy stuff and travel about. It's also unrealistic to tell the developing world that they aren't allowed to catch up and aspire to the lifestyles we have enjoyed in the West for decades. A lot could be saved by encouraging the sourcing of products and material closer to the point of sale, but you're never going to eradicate things being shipped across the world.

    We have to move away from burning fossil fuel, both for the movement of goods and people and also for the generation of electricity. In the meantime, efficiency has to be sought wherever possible.

    Obviously, ordinary individuals cannot develop new forms of transport and power supply. It's up to governments and big corporations to deliver.
    Fair point regards new transport & power supply, but regards culture you don't have to "tell" anyone anything. The only reason folk expect to live this way is because it's what they are used to. It's like saying "you can't live without mobile phones now, society would crumble and no one would be able to eat". All it takes is for folk to start taking a bit of responsibility and stop passing the buck, and breed a less wasteful, less demanding, more tolerant mindset.

    E.g. Have kids? encourage them to make the most of what they have and don't spoil them with a million things trying to keep up wit hthe Jones. Let them see the fun in playing with mates and a bag of wind instead of staying inside burning energy away on the Xbox etc.

    It's the culture which is killing us, if we rely on new power sources all that will happen is demand will increase until that is used up or breaks it's limits. Until the mindset changes we're walking the same path.


  13. #12
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lefkasman View Post
    This year people should ask themselves, do I need it or do I want it? That's my yearly excuse for being a tight twat.
    Mine too


  14. #13
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Instead of guaranteeing Chinese a massive cost of electric we should pump more into greener, renewable sources. If I gave you the choice between something that will run out, or something that wouldn't, it'd be simple. I still want internal combustion engines on my bikes though

    "Ive only met Andy....last week actually and can confirm he is in 2nd place in sexiest fucker on here stakes." -Barry

  15. #14
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swagman View Post
    As some of you will be aware I'm one of those weird hippy people who believes that we should be making practical changes to our lifestyles to negate the onset of man made global warming.

    Having just watched this....



    ....it got me thinking about how forum members perceive the threat of man made global warming and what, if anything, we can do about it.

    Do you think we can engineer our way out of the problem, or will we have to reduce our fossil fuelled lifestyle?

    Is it down to politicians to lead us from expected disaster, or will collective people power change the lawmakers hand?

    Do you even believe in climate change, or is it an unproven science created to tax and control us even more?

    My beliefs are firmly nailed to the mast, as most of you will know. Where do you stand?
    Before I answer are wind turbines and solar panels really an alternative? Im not taking the piss its a genuine question to someone who will know.


  16. #15

    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    The developing world will make our carbon emissions pale into insignificance for the next 20 plus years until they are on a similar level to us. Realistically, unless the governments in the developed world are going to massively subsidise green energy in these regions then they will carry on regardless.
    I consider myself to have a reasonable carbon footprint and really unless I change my job I couldn't do much to reduce it. I have a fuel efficient car, don't use it at weekends, despite having access to free fuel and drive it steadily. My house is pretty well insulated, I buy British goods where possible so keep my food miles down.
    I'm not sure what can be done to make me reduce my impact other than tax the last little bit of dignity out of me and that would only be diverted elsewhere anyway.
    It's down to individuals to do their best but with the realisation that the rest of the world will be carrying on as normal.
    Jobs fucked.


  17. #16
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wes' Organ View Post
    The developing world will make our carbon emissions pale into insignificance for the next 20 plus years until they are on a similar level to us. Realistically, unless the governments in the developed world are going to massively subsidise green energy in these regions then they will carry on regardless.
    I consider myself to have a reasonable carbon footprint and really unless I change my job I couldn't do much to reduce it. I have a fuel efficient car, don't use it at weekends, despite having access to free fuel and drive it steadily. My house is pretty well insulated, I buy British goods where possible so keep my food miles down.
    I'm not sure what can be done to make me reduce my impact other than tax the last little bit of dignity out of me and that would only be diverted elsewhere anyway.
    It's down to individuals to do their best but with the realisation that the rest of the world will be carrying on as normal.
    Jobs fucked.
    Hippy


  18. #17

    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    Hippy
    Far out man.


  19. #18
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wes' Organ View Post
    The developing world will make our carbon emissions pale into insignificance for the next 20 plus years until they are on a similar level to us. Realistically, unless the governments in the developed world are going to massively subsidise green energy in these regions then they will carry on regardless.
    I consider myself to have a reasonable carbon footprint and really unless I change my job I couldn't do much to reduce it. I have a fuel efficient car, don't use it at weekends, despite having access to free fuel and drive it steadily. My house is pretty well insulated, I buy British goods where possible so keep my food miles down.
    I'm not sure what can be done to make me reduce my impact other than tax the last little bit of dignity out of me and that would only be diverted elsewhere anyway.
    It's down to individuals to do their best but with the realisation that the rest of the world will be carrying on as normal.
    Jobs fucked.
    Me too, most of my heat comes from a wood burner. When it gets really cold I have a wood fired boiler. Hot water is from solar panels and I'm hoping to find some way of connecting it up to the wood boiler in the winter.
    I drive a 1.2 car but only when its necessary. If I was building the house again there are improvements I could make, but now I think I'm doing all I can.


  20. #19
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Capitalism will never give up waste.


  21. #20
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    Before I answer are wind turbines and solar panels really an alternative? Im not taking the piss its a genuine question to someone who will know.
    Good question mate and realistically solar and wind cannot be relied upon on their own to provide a stable energy solution.

    Obviously, it's dark at night so solar is limited in its use 24/7, but the wind blows consistently. Being an island nation we should be using tidal generation throughout the UK, but as ever instead of doing small, local schemes and getting the technology right first what we do instead is chuck money at grand schemes like the Cardiff Tidal Lagoon which will cost mega bucks and then say that it doesn't offer value for money before deciding o shelve the technology altogether.

    Last year green energy provided more electricity in the UK than coal, for the first time ever, but still, when taking into account all of the different energy provisions available across the nation accounted for just under 10% of our energy needs.


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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Unity View Post
    Capitalism will never give up waste.
    Where there's muck, there's brass.


  23. #22
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    The sun beams down more energy on the planet every day than we could ever use. We just need to find the right ways to harness and use it.

    Easier said than done, but we've made a start, what needs to happen is a much bigger roll out of current technology like rooftop solar panels and serious investment put into improving existing solar tech and find new ways to generate and store solar power - as well as electrifying more things that currently run on fossil fuels.

    Also, something that's forgotten is that Earth's trees absorb CO2 so the more deforestation occurs, the worse effect our emissions have. So something has to be done to stop the world's great forests being destroyed.


  24. #23
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    The elephant in the room here that governments and others seem to ignore is the simple fact that there are too many of us on the planet.

    It's very hard issue but none the less very relevant and all the measure we me take about green energy and using less fossil fuels are all very laudable but in actual fact all they are doing is putting off the inevitable.

    In 1900 there were something like 1.5 billion people on the planet by 1950 this had grown only to 2.5 billion but right now it is something around 7 billion, what will it be by the end of this century?

    Those increases are massive and they are the heart of the issue.Population control is the problem that dare not speak it's name! There are lots of reason why this is happening, infant mortality is far less than it was, more people are surviving to old age, less people in the third world are dying from famine etc.

    Now I don't know the answer to the problem but I do believe that if we don't resolve this one there will be a natural correction (we will not be able to produce sufficient food or water possibly) and we may just disappear like the dinosaurs and the earth will be left to repair itself ready for the next dominant species.


  25. #24
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by alabamared View Post
    The elephant in the room here that governments and others seem to ignore is the simple fact that there are too many of us on the planet.

    It's very hard issue but none the less very relevant and all the measure we me take about green energy and using less fossil fuels are all very laudable but in actual fact all they are doing is putting off the inevitable.

    In 1900 there were something like 1.5 billion people on the planet by 1950 this had grown only to 2.5 billion but right now it is something around 7 billion, what will it be by the end of this century?

    Those increases are massive and they are the heart of the issue.Population control is the problem that dare not speak it's name! There are lots of reason why this is happening, infant mortality is far less than it was, more people are surviving to old age, less people in the third world are dying from famine etc.

    Now I don't know the answer to the problem but I do believe that if we don't resolve this one there will be a natural correction (we will not be able to produce sufficient food or water possibly) and we may just disappear like the dinosaurs and the earth will be left to repair itself ready for the next dominant species.
    Not 1 politician has got the balls to campaign on this subject. Because it ain't going to be popular. But its true.


  26. #25
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Would be classed as racist


 

 

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