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  1. #26
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Barbus View Post
    It's unrealistic to tell people they aren't allowed to buy stuff and travel about. It's also unrealistic to tell the developing world that they aren't allowed to catch up and aspire to the lifestyles we have enjoyed in the West for decades. A lot could be saved by encouraging the sourcing of products and material closer to the point of sale, but you're never going to eradicate things being shipped across the world.

    We have to move away from burning fossil fuel, both for the movement of goods and people and also for the generation of electricity. In the meantime, efficiency has to be sought wherever possible.

    Obviously, ordinary individuals cannot develop new forms of transport and power supply. It's up to governments and big corporations to deliver.
    It's obviously a current problem, but maybe some of the obsessing about dealing with emissions is akin to people at the beginning of the 20th Centruy obsessing about what could be done about the escalating problem of horse dung on the streets of the cities of the then developed nations. What I mean is, these conversation often have a 'zero sum game' outlook to them - that is, that only current solutions will be available and that no new innovation will happen.

    What if there were new technologies which, despite years of setbacks, are every very close to producing viable alternatives to current energy sources...

    In August 2014, Phoenix Nuclear Labs announced the sale of a high-yield neutron generator that could sustain 5×1011 deuterium fusion reactions per second over a 24-hour period.[150] In October 2014, Lockheed Martin's Skunk Works announced the development of a high-beta fusion reactor that they hope to yield a functioning 100-megawatt prototype by 2017 and to be ready for regular operation by 2022.[151][152][153]

    Deep-space exploration, as well as higher-velocity lower-cost space transport services in general would be enabled by this compact fusion reactor technology.[154]

    In January 2015, the polywell was presented at Microsoft Research.[155]

    In August, 2015, MIT announced a tokamak it named ARC fusion reactor design using rare-earth barium-copper oxide (REBCO) superconducting tapes to produce high-magnetic field coils that it claimed produce comparable magnetic field strength in a smaller configuration than other designs.[156]

    In October 2015, researchers at the Max Planck Institute of Plasma Physics completed building the largest stellarator to date, named Wendelstein 7-X. On December 10, they successfully produced the first helium plasma, and on February 3, 2016 produced the device's first Hydrogen plasma.[157] With plasma discharges lasting up to 30 minutes, Wendelstein 7-X will try to demonstrate the essential stellarator attribute: continuous operation of a high-temperature hydrogen plasma.



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  3. #27
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.


  4. #28
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Tell the cows to stop farting


  5. #29
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by OLDMANRED View Post
    Tell the cows to stop farting
    Funny that you say that, but methane from cows which is a huge problem, isn't from farting, but from burping as they chew the grass.

    You learn something new everyday


  6. #30
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Brazil are tearing down forests so they can breed more cows, that's double bubble.

    "Ive only met Andy....last week actually and can confirm he is in 2nd place in sexiest fucker on here stakes." -Barry

  7. #31
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    Would be classed as racist
    I'm sure if Trump is elected we'll have reduced the worlds population in no time.

    That America, Russia and China will no longer exist could be quite a good thing.


  8. #32

    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravi View Post
    It's obviously a current problem, but maybe some of the obsessing about dealing with emissions is akin to people at the beginning of the 20th Centruy obsessing about what could be done about the escalating problem of horse dung on the streets of the cities of the then developed nations. What I mean is, these conversation often have a 'zero sum game' outlook to them - that is, that only current solutions will be available and that no new innovation will happen.
    Nice point, but we can't blithely assume Future Man will come up with a solution, particularly if the dismissive attitude to the issue means cutbacks to scientific investigation in that area.

    Campaigns to reduce emissions are not solely about trying to solve the issue directly - they encourage the planet as a whole to face up to the problem in a rational, scientific and hopefully humane way.


  9. #33
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alexandro Garibaldi View Post
    Nice point, but we can't blithely assume Future Man will come up with a solution, particularly if the dismissive attitude to the issue means cutbacks to scientific investigation in that area.

    Campaigns to reduce emissions are not solely about trying to solve the issue directly - they encourage the planet as a whole to face up to the problem in a rational, scientific and hopefully humane way.
    Very true Alex.

    Future technology will become even more power hungry, you only have to look at the plethora of hand held devices available to us now to see which way things are going.

    That we can engineer ourselves out of these future problems is a stab in the dark right now.

    The recently agreed Paris Climate Accord shows how difficult the problem is. While it is agreed that to stop ourselves passing over the precipice into a world we don't know requires us to keep global temperature rises beneath 2 degrees centigrade and hopefully nearer to 1.5 degrees centigrade, based on pre=industrial measurements, now that the numbers have been crunched following the Paris agreement, we are actually destined to surpass our none binding agreement by as much as another 1.5 degrees, putting the planet and her population into unchatered territory by the end of the century.

    We really are facing a catastrophe of unknown proportions if this happens.


  10. #34
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swagman View Post
    Very true Alex.

    Future technology will become even more power hungry, you only have to look at the plethora of hand held devices available to us now to see which way things are going.

    That we can engineer ourselves out of these future problems is a stab in the dark right now.

    The recently agreed Paris Climate Accord shows how difficult the problem is. While it is agreed that to stop ourselves passing over the precipice into a world we don't know requires us to keep global temperature rises beneath 2 degrees centigrade and hopefully nearer to 1.5 degrees centigrade, based on pre=industrial measurements, now that the numbers have been crunched following the Paris agreement, we are actually destined to surpass our none binding agreement by as much as another 1.5 degrees, putting the planet and her population into unchatered territory by the end of the century.

    We really are facing a catastrophe of unknown proportions if this happens.
    The demand for energy increases every year and will only increase further, which is why new sources of generation are required. The move away from antiquated methods such as digging up stuff from the ground and burning it has to happen regardless of climate change because these sources of energy aren't sufficient. Fusion power is far from a stab in the dark, as those articles I posted show, and does at least have the potential to bridge this looming energy gap. I fully expect China to be generating a significant amount of its electricity from Fusion within the next thirty years.


  11. #35
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Well say goodbye to the Paris agreement and any hope of any American progress on climate change for the next 4 years.

    A terrible result for the planet.


  12. #36
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Barbus View Post
    Well say goodbye to the Paris agreement and any hope of any American progress on climate change for the next 4 years.

    A terrible result for the planet.
    Did you ever think it was going to work anyway?

    It might just be the kick in the balls the world-wide illuminati need to realise the errors of their ways.

    Nothing significant has been agreed yet. The closer we step towards catastrophe, the greater the respose required will be.

    In many ways we need to be that few extra steps down the road, so that theevidence of mankinds destruction is there for all to see.


  13. #37
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Interesting comments from George Monbiot regarding pollution, especially from motor vehicles.

    I wonder who'll bite first!

    https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...llution-diesel


  14. #38
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swagman View Post
    Did you ever think it was going to work anyway?

    It might just be the kick in the balls the world-wide illuminati need to realise the errors of their ways.

    Nothing significant has been agreed yet. The closer we step towards catastrophe, the greater the respose required will be.

    In many ways we need to be that few extra steps down the road, so that theevidence of mankinds destruction is there for all to see.
    I think it's woefully unambitious and doesn't go nearly far enough, but it's obviously progress and is better than nothing.
    If Trump opposed it for that reason and he wanted a more far reaching deal instead that would be positive.
    But he doesn't, he believes it's all a hoax and just says he's going to pull America out of the agreement.
    I read the other day that he's going to cut climate change spending as well.
    It's a disaster.

    Last edited by Barbus; 09-11-16 at 09:38.

  15. #39
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.




  16. #40
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Not in the UK they dont

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  17. #41
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.



    doyen of boomer energy

  18. #42
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    So 2016 will be the hottest globally ever, an average of 1.2 degrees above pre-industrial records

    https://www.theguardian.com/environm...record-un-says

    Scarily, this is at a time when the use of fossil fuels has plateaued for the third consecutive year.

    https://www.theguardian.com/environm...rd-year-in-row

    I wonder where temperatures will go when Trump rips up the USA's green policies


  19. #43
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    "Up" would be my guess.

    „I believe in socialism because it seems more humanitarian, rather than every man for himself and 'I'm alright jack' and all those arsehole businessmen with all the loot. I made up my mind from viewing society from that angle. That's where I'm from and there's where I've made my decisions from. That's why I believe in socialism“

    — Joe Strummer

  20. #44
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Oh dear....

    https://www.theguardian.com/environm...arm-scientists

    At least we'll be able to rape the earth of more oil sooner than we expected.

    Silver linings and all that.


  21. #45
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    It's ok, we'll be able to tell our grandkids about those awesome few coal mining jobs we managed to create back in 2016. That is, if they can hear you through the oxygen mask.

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  22. #46
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Interesting and scary comment by George Monbiot looking at work, the environment and perhaps where the world is heading.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...ate-change-war


  23. #47
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swagman View Post
    Interesting and scary comment by George Monbiot looking at work, the environment and perhaps where the world is heading.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...ate-change-war
    I just read that, and he's spot on as usual.

    There's also an excellent piece by John Harris (again!) in today's Graun on a visit to Lincolnshire about the impact of Brexit there.

    Well worth a read.


  24. #48
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Is infrastructure the way to increase productivity?

    https://www.theguardian.com/environm...rey-than-green


  25. #49
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swagman View Post
    Is infrastructure the way to increase productivity?

    https://www.theguardian.com/environm...rey-than-green
    Not in my book.

    Germany is more productive than the U.K., and that is not necessarily dependent on massive infrastructure projects like the Tories seem to moot.

    The German model (for those unaware, Germany itself is basically a loose collective of separately governed republics) actually boosts competition between the regions, especially in the former West Germany.

    Unlike in the U.K., where you have London and then everywhere else.


  26. #50
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    Default Re: Going to hell in a handbasket.

    Quote Originally Posted by chriscl View Post
    Not in my book.

    Germany is more productive than the U.K., and that is not necessarily dependent on massive infrastructure projects like the Tories seem to moot.

    The German model (for those unaware, Germany itself is basically a loose collective of separately governed republics) actually boosts competition between the regions, especially in the former West Germany.

    Unlike in the U.K., where you have London and then everywhere else.
    Aint large parts of east germany just washed up waste lands like the pit villages of old here?


 

 

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