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  1. #76

    Default Re: Ireland legalises same-sex marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Barbus View Post
    Sorry I missed this point yesterday. You do know that Christian Europe almost constantly fought amongst itself until 1945?
    Of course, but Christianity endured these and while the wars waged there were large areas of religious stability protected by empires which allowed culture, industry and economy to flourish in such places. I think it's fair to say that Britain has been a stable, war-free country since 1707, and during the 200 years that followed we thrived, developing modern democracy, law and technology. By the end of that period we were the most powerful empire on earth - this, not coincidentally, was the first time in British history that a single state religion was allowed to stand for any period of time without one religious monarch deciding to persecute the other lot.

    Now I'm not saying the industrial revolution and the British Empire happened because we were Protestant and that's the best one, but because it was a period of relative domestic stability with religion at its centre. After a century of revolutions, plagues and fires, during which all we managed to produce was some silly wigs and a few derivative Cathedrals, we imported some Protestant toffs from Europe, established an enduring royal line, and yes, used religion to impose order on the population. This was how the ancient Athenians, the ancient Romans, the Catholic Church during the Renaissance, the Habsburgs and even the United States of America ushered in their great ages too - not by diminishing religion, but by bringing it to the fore and making it strong.


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  3. #77
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    Default Re: Ireland legalises same-sex marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex View Post
    Of course, but Christianity endured these and while the wars waged there were large areas of religious stability protected by empires which allowed culture, industry and economy to flourish in such places. I think it's fair to say that Britain has been a stable, war-free country since 1707, and during the 200 years that followed we thrived, developing modern democracy, law and technology. By the end of that period we were the most powerful empire on earth - this, not coincidentally, was the first time in British history that a single state religion was allowed to stand for any period of time without one religious monarch deciding to persecute the other lot.

    Now I'm not saying the industrial revolution and the British Empire happened because we were Protestant and that's the best one, but because it was a period of relative domestic stability with religion at its centre. After a century of revolutions, plagues and fires, during which all we managed to produce was some silly wigs and a few derivative Cathedrals, we imported some Protestant toffs from Europe, established an enduring royal line, and yes, used religion to impose order on the population. This was how the ancient Athenians, the ancient Romans, the Catholic Church during the Renaissance, the Habsburgs and even the United States of America ushered in their great ages too - not by diminishing religion, but by bringing it to the fore and making it strong.
    Agree mostly... but I think your dating is a bit premature-we had good ole bonny Prince Charlie ravaging through the countryside as late as 1745-he got as far as Derby and then turned back (and who can blame him) before his army was defeated at Culloden (was that the same year-or maybe a year later?).

    The rise of the British Empire (which is worth re-iterating, is the biggest/richest/greatest empire that this planet has ever seen) was built on "the protestant work ethic".


  4. #78
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    Default Re: Ireland legalises same-sex marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by virgo View Post
    The rise of the British Empire (which is worth re-iterating, is the biggest/richest/greatest empire that this planet has ever seen) was built on "the protestant work ethic".
    And the persecution of the Catholic minority - especially in Ireland, of course.

    Indeed, you could take the point that large parts of Ireland were in a state of insurrection from the early 1800s through until the Easter Rising in 1916, which of course led to the founding of the Irish Free State in 1922.

    „I believe in socialism because it seems more humanitarian, rather than every man for himself and 'I'm alright jack' and all those arsehole businessmen with all the loot. I made up my mind from viewing society from that angle. That's where I'm from and there's where I've made my decisions from. That's why I believe in socialism“

    — Joe Strummer

  5. #79
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    Default Re: Ireland legalises same-sex marriage




  6. #80
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    Default Re: Ireland legalises same-sex marriage

    From the Guardian today.

    The last prosecution for blasphemy in Ireland was in 1855, but three years ago Irish police investigated comments made by Stephen Fry on television in which the comedian described God as “capricious”, “mean-minded”, and an “utter maniac”. The investigation was later dropped after Gardaí decided insufficient numbers of people had been outraged.

    ....and God didst verily say unto Steven Fry, "Shut yer gob you fat poof!"


 

 

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