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  1. #2501
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by sedgred View Post
    The difference is the leadership being shown by Farage, immediate action to put distance between the fledgling party and the comments made. I know the chattering classes are no doubt wetting themselves with relief at this gaffe, the press loving the chance to have a pop.

    Will it cost them any votes in May, I don't think so, why because people are still sickened by the the three main parties and their self serving antics.
    Let's not forget that a large number of Kippers probably agree with the anti-Islam sentiment.

    Not trying to have a pop at UKIP supporters here, but revelations like "member X is a racist" probably impacts them a lot less than if that was a Labour member.

    They still won't win any seats though. Might overtake Lib Dems in number of votes but their equal spread across the country will see a lot of noise result in a lot of nothing.


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  3. #2502
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by RobbieLePop View Post
    Let's not forget that a large number of Kippers probably agree with the anti-Islam sentiment.

    Not trying to have a pop at UKIP supporters here, but revelations like "member X is a racist" probably impacts them a lot less than if that was a Labour member.

    They still won't win any seats though. Might overtake Lib Dems in number of votes but their equal spread across the country will see a lot of noise result in a lot of nothing.
    What you say is true Robbie although I would add that a lot of staunch Labour and Tory voters also hold anti-Islamic views.

    The trick for the Kippers is can they motivate the large number of disillusioned people who haven't voted recently? Lump that together with the Blue Collar Powellist/exBNPers and the Middle Englanders who are sick to teeth of Cameron's liberalism and it could get interesting?


  4. #2503
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Juif Rouge View Post
    What you say is true Robbie although I would add that a lot of staunch Labour and Tory voters also hold anti-Islamic views.

    The trick for the Kippers is can they motivate the large number of disillusioned people who haven't voted recently? Lump that together with the Blue Collar Powellist/exBNPers and the Middle Englanders who are sick to teeth of Cameron's liberalism and it could get interesting?
    Oh no doubt, but I think the proportion of voters who would be angered by what would appear to be in-house racist views would be greater within the three main parties. No proof, just my belief. People half expect UKIP to lean that way anyway after being brandished like that in the press for the past three years. I doubt many UKIP voters will change their allegiance if 'shock, racist party member!' comes to light.

    Problem for Kippers in vote numbers is that like the Lib Dems last election they'll enjoy a large percentage of the voting intention, but when push comes to shove a lot of those people will vote either Labour or Tory to keep their least preferred out. Unlike the Lib Dems there is no real core support base for UKIP unlike the South West for Lib Dems. Sure they seem to do well in the North West but they struggle for majorities anywhere.

    FPTP will kill UKIPs election chances in 2015, not their manifesto or what their members views are. Someone with a bit more time and knowledge might want to crank the numbers to work out what the swing % to UKIP would have to be for them to start picking up double figure number of seats. It'd be huge I reckon.


  5. #2504
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    If UKIP win the Euro elections they could use that bounce to win a couple of seats maybe Eastleigh or Boston and they could target a few in the north like South Shields, but Robbie is right with FPTP it will be a huge challenge. With no boundary changes Labour have the advantage but the polls are closer than expected, I suspect Labour will just fall short of a majority. Lib Dems are totally right to rule out minority rule a party that believes in proportional representation and in turn coalition government, they believe in cooperation government. You must give credit to Liberals for ironically sticking to their principles of shared government.

    Anyway for Labour the biggest election coming up is Scottish independence they must fight tooth and nail to keep them in, the Tories need wages to start picking up now if they do the momentum to the election could be very good for them and the Libs well they just need to hope they dont get annihilated so they could be kingmakers again in another potential coalition.


  6. #2505
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Tories will win the next election. Might not be a majority but they will win most seats.


  7. #2506
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Emmerson wants us to judge UKIP on their actions and policies; OK then.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014...?utm_hp_ref=uk

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/ti...l-ivory-trade/



    Yep they are *****. Even if you want us to leave the EU, voting for them in the upcoming European elections won't do a single thing to achieve that, but you'll get more of these numpties in the EU parliament to twat about like this. They are so rabidly anti everything EU they'll even vote against a crackdown on something so disgusting as the illegal ivory trade.


  8. #2507
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by RobbieLePop View Post
    Tories will win the next election. Might not be a majority but they will win most seats.
    It will be an interesting one. I think it could drop either way but neither Labour or Tory will get a majority in my opinion. If I had to predict I would say Labour will just pip it.


  9. #2508
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by GOBIAS Industries View Post
    It will be an interesting one. I think it could drop either way but neither Labour or Tory will get a majority in my opinion. If I had to predict I would say Labour will just pip it.
    Problem Labour have is that most people still blame them for the recession and don't trust them to do any better if re-elected. Given the headline news of economic performance recently too under what most believe are Tory decisions despite it being a coalition government, then Labour frankly are only going to get weaker and weaker in the polls up until the election. I'm not saying our economy is fixed by any means, but most voters don't really care about the inner workings of the economy and will simply see GDP up, inflation down and unemployment down. They won't care whether such figures are based on structural reformation or a sudden influx of easy access to credit. Osborn and Cameron are playing a good game at the moment. Help To Buy is a god awful scheme but again it'll help them in the short term to win the next election.

    Bookies seem to be standing by Labour to edge it but I reckon that's because where the money is, not what is likely to happen.


  10. #2509
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by EmmersonForest4 View Post
    Its a complete story because its to do with who makes our laws and can we get rid of them, the only decent point you had is the Queen who is unelected but compared to Jose Manuel Barroso she is a puppy she cant affect my life except for the 10p a year she gets off me. Gay Marriage was is the Lib Dem manifesto and has public support. As for Scotland we have no right to take part in their business its self determination how dictatorial is it if the UK votes for Scotland to stay. A referendum was on the common market not political union, the UK public despise CAP or the fisheries policy and we can do nothing about it.

    The point is principally if you are a politician and you are giving away law making powers you must have a referendum it goes past left or right here if not then what stops UK parliament giving the US espionage laws? Public opinion is firmly against CAP or fisheries policy yet we can not repeal it or vote anyone in to stop it its disgraceful.
    Who says Gay Marriage has public support? You are making exactly the same assumption as those that assume the Monarchy has majority support. People shouting down those that object does not equate to consensus.

    Scotland and England were joined by an Act of Union. it wasn't an English invasion. Scottish independence will imply a separate independence for those countries left behind. where is my vote in this massive change?

    I say again being out of Europe gives us no more real say in our destiny than it does being in. Leaving Europe just makes us look like the small minded little islanders that we claim not to be.


  11. #2510

    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by rogerthecat View Post
    Who says Gay Marriage has public support?
    Well, YouGov for start....

    Quote Originally Posted by EmmersonForest4 View Post
    we can do that without a corporate EU who loves banks and multinationals.
    New EU rules mean the bank has to ask its shareholders for approval of annual bonuses above 100% of base salaries.


  12. #2511
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    EU regulations makes it almost impossible for small companies to compete the big companies love regulation like the energy companies because it stops competition stone dead, Bonuses are a gimmick stop them and you will still have massive companies taking advantages of governments trying to regulate them. If the shareholders agree to it then what? Thats why big business who everyone berates wants to stay in this club because it gurantees them a market to dominate.

    Last edited by EmmersonForest4; 25-04-14 at 14:36.

  13. #2512
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Barbus View Post
    Emmerson wants us to judge UKIP on their actions and policies; OK then.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014...?utm_hp_ref=uk

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/ti...l-ivory-trade/



    Yep they are *****. Even if you want us to leave the EU, voting for them in the upcoming European elections won't do a single thing to achieve that, but you'll get more of these numpties in the EU parliament to twat about like this. They are so rabidly anti everything EU they'll even vote against a crackdown on something so disgusting as the illegal ivory trade.
    UKIP dosent like the EU its not an endorsement of Ivory trade I dont like the EU hence there appeal in that aspect to me. As soon as we get rid of that horrid institution then we can get back to interstate cooperation without this stupid centralisation things like Climate change, animal poaching, europol can all be done without eurcrats and stealing sovereignty, its funny the EU didn't care about fish rights in terms of discards what a waste that went on for ages. Obviously if UKIP came out and said they support the sale of ivory then that is deplorable and morally repugnant. Another story of how people want to stitch them up they despise EU centralised power and I do its unaccountable and illegitimate so they vote against it if it was an interstate cooperation then they might vote in favour. They are sticking by their principles very rare in politics if you want to bash them do it properly get David Sylvester or the expense claims even Farrages wife being employed by him they are not whiter than white but then again no political party is they are the only party that wants themselves to have less power(small government).

    The EU is not whiter than white either they are an expansionist state that wants an army Baroness Ashton and the commission are trying to put this through also they supported Ukrainian mobsters that killed 13 Ukrainian policeman dont get me wrong the President should stand trial as well I take no sides in that and thats my point the EU has. Its all tit for tat UKIP dosent want the EU to have more powers that dosent mean that they dont support these legislations in principle.


  14. #2513
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Big business will always win out with or without regulation. The ability to procure and therefore sell at reduced price means consumers will always favour them.

    Do you think the dominant businesses in their respective markets only gained dominance since 1973?


  15. #2514
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by rogerthecat View Post
    Who says Gay Marriage has public support? You are making exactly the same assumption as those that assume the Monarchy has majority support. People shouting down those that object does not equate to consensus.

    Scotland and England were joined by an Act of Union. it wasn't an English invasion. Scottish independence will imply a separate independence for those countries left behind. where is my vote in this massive change?

    I say again being out of Europe gives us no more real say in our destiny than it does being in. Leaving Europe just makes us look like the small minded little islanders that we claim not to be.
    5.5 billion live in sovereign states over one hundred countries the EU has 27 members we are the minority by far so when you say coming out is small minded that is laughable, you are equally a little European only wanting white immigrants to come you see how I could easily do it but I dont because its not true of you as it is of me. Gay Marriage was in the Lib Dem manifesto they are in government as for Scotland let me get this straight if we all vote for them to stay in they must stay in the union? To me that is extremely conservative. Being out of Europe gives us a massive say in our destiny we can sign our own free trade deals, get our fishing industry back, control our borders and we would have a more diverse immigration policy, we are free to make our own regulations we wouldnt have to pay the EU, we could trade with them, etc...

    People are scared of it because of the put down by the left of this country they often say we are nothing we amount to nothing our country has passed it god knows what they think of Australia or New Zealand they must think these places are sespits. We have the 6th largest economy in the world we dont need the EU. For me we get independance then we set up our club without political insitutions and cooperate how about we just have a European Area Organisation then we meet together to agree europol, climate targets, illegal drugs and animal trade we dont need brussels for this.


  16. #2515

    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by EmmersonForest4 View Post
    EU regulations makes it almost impossible for small companies to compete the big companies love regulation like the energy companies because it stops competition stone dead, Bonuses are a gimmick stop them and you will still have massive companies taking advantages of governments trying to regulate them. If the shareholders agree to it then what? Thats why big business who everyone berates wants to stay in this club because it gurantees them qa market to dominate.
    I'm sure former commodities trader Nigel Farage is the one to put an end to all that then...

    #teamnigel

    There's no mention of business de-regulation or support for smaller businesses in the UKIP policies on 'Rebuilding Prosperity', just some stuff about taxes, abandoning any effort towards green energy and slashing foreign aid. Scrapping "green taxes and wind turbine subsidies" is hardly sticking it to the fat cats, is it?


  17. #2516
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by RobbieLePop View Post
    Big business will always win out with or without regulation. The ability to procure and therefore sell at reduced price means consumers will always favour them.

    Do you think the dominant businesses in their respective markets only gained dominance since 1973?
    When the markets were freer big business had a harder time, for example employment law which in principle is a good thing but it only helps big business small business have to put it in the risk side of the balance sheet, its counter productive, just like green levies dont get me wrong the principle is superb I want to protect the environment but green energy costs a lot on the bills and benefits rich land owners. The EU makes it a good place for big business especially with its competition laws and tax areas.


  18. #2517
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex View Post
    I'm sure former commodities trader Nigel Farage is the one to put an end to all that then...

    #teamnigel

    There's no mention of business de-regulation or support for smaller businesses in the UKIP policies on 'Rebuilding Prosperity', just some stuff about taxes, abandoning any effort towards green energy and slashing foreign aid. Scrapping "green taxes and wind turbine subsidies" is hardly sticking it to the fat cats, is it?
    Did I say anything about UKIP? Nothing I am just giving my view on the EU, I dont support any party 100% nor does anyone I dare to suggest it would be ludicrous to do it. Yeah Nigel gets things right even occasionally Labour do just take the childcare policy that is smart it puts people in work lets mums go in to work and keeps children safe, Cameron got it right with austerity its empowered governments over banks and in time will give the working class financial freedom its painful now I agree but thats what happens when people and governments go off to payday companies. Sort the debt out kills the banksters. As for Green taxes its a double edged sword I can see both sides as Green energy puts bills up and rich and owners make money off it whereas you do want to protect the environment, its you call the poor pay higher prices for energy or we damage the planet a little more.


  19. #2518

    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by EmmersonForest4 View Post
    Did I say anything about UKIP?


    Do you really want me to answer that?


  20. #2519

    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex View Post
    Happy Easter, Christians - the Mail on Sunday thinks you are all mugs:



    A 30-something journalist, no doubt trained in mendacious behaviour as part of his job, manages to trick a 60-year-old charity volunteer into giving him food that could otherwise have gone to someone who deserved it. Well done, you must be so proud.
    Nottingham volunteer service comes to the rescue of hungry Daily Mail journalists:

    http://www.nottinghamcvs.co.uk/news/...ng-journalists


  21. #2520
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by EmmersonForest4 View Post
    When the markets were freer big business had a harder time, for example employment law which in principle is a good thing but it only helps big business small business have to put it in the risk side of the balance sheet, its counter productive, just like green levies dont get me wrong the principle is superb I want to protect the environment but green energy costs a lot on the bills and benefits rich land owners. The EU makes it a good place for big business especially with its competition laws and tax areas.
    Are you sure?

    The Conservative government has sought to chip-away at legislation, mostly from the EU, that actually protects workers' rights, to make it easier for businesses in this country to fire staff without just cause or reason.

    "When the markets were freer" - or, before EU laws that better protected workers - "big business" could essentially run roughshod over their workers.

    In this country only the Trade Unions and the TUC stood up to big employers, and we know what successive Conservative governments did to the Unions.

    Elsewhere in Europe - Germany and France for example - most large companies have "Works Councils" whose principles are protected by EU law.

    Those Works Councils are these primarily to protect the employee.

    Of course, in the UK, workers paradise that it is, there is no such equivalent.

    „I believe in socialism because it seems more humanitarian, rather than every man for himself and 'I'm alright jack' and all those arsehole businessmen with all the loot. I made up my mind from viewing society from that angle. That's where I'm from and there's where I've made my decisions from. That's why I believe in socialism“

    — Joe Strummer

  22. #2521
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by RobbieLePop View Post
    Problem Labour have is that most people still blame them for the recession and don't trust them to do any better if re-elected. Given the headline news of economic performance recently too under what most believe are Tory decisions despite it being a coalition government, then Labour frankly are only going to get weaker and weaker in the polls up until the election. I'm not saying our economy is fixed by any means, but most voters don't really care about the inner workings of the economy and will simply see GDP up, inflation down and unemployment down. They won't care whether such figures are based on structural reformation or a sudden influx of easy access to credit. Osborn and Cameron are playing a good game at the moment. Help To Buy is a god awful scheme but again it'll help them in the short term to win the next election.

    Bookies seem to be standing by Labour to edge it but I reckon that's because where the money is, not what is likely to happen.
    The Tories are in overdrive at the moment convincing people that the economy is on an upward spiral and that their cuts have been vindicated and that we need to stick with them. I don't think most people see it.

    However they didn't get a majority last time despite the tide turning against a Labour party who had been in a long time. I think a lot voted for Liberal Democrat last time because they didn't want to vote Tory but the Liberals vote could collapse this time and should return to Labour. I also think UKIP could suck away more Tory voters than they will Labour.

    Like I say, it will be very close and a very interesting couple of days await us next year. I'm probably looking forward to it more than the World Cup. Not sure if that means I'm officially an old boring bastard or I'm just a bit footballed out!!


  23. #2522
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by GOBIAS Industries View Post
    The Tories are in overdrive at the moment convincing people that the economy is on an upward spiral and that their cuts have been vindicated and that we need to stick with them. I don't think most people see it.

    However they didn't get a majority last time despite the tide turning against a Labour party who had been in a long time. I think a lot voted for Liberal Democrat last time because they didn't want to vote Tory but the Liberals vote could collapse this time and should return to Labour. I also think UKIP could suck away more Tory voters than they will Labour.

    Like I say, it will be very close and a very interesting couple of days await us next year. I'm probably looking forward to it more than the World Cup. Not sure if that means I'm officially an old boring bastard or I'm just a bit footballed out!!
    Most people don't feel they're better off but they do, whether right or wrong, believe that the national finances are improving under this Tory government. Relentless media bias and posturing regardless, that alone will be what wins them the election.


  24. #2523
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Irony alert, Liberal Euro Political Broadcast uses a student study's to highlight the positives.



    I wonder what comes first the ambition to be a Politician, or the fact that you are thick skinned and devious enough, at times even dishonest enough to succeed as one


  25. #2524
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Turns out the actor playing the builder in the ukip "EU policy at work" is an EU migrant.


  26. #2525
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    Default Re: A week in politics

    Quote Originally Posted by sedgred View Post
    Irony alert, Liberal Euro Political Broadcast uses a student study's to highlight the positives.



    I wonder what comes first the ambition to be a Politician, or the fact that you are thick skinned and devious enough, at times even dishonest enough to succeed as one
    Quote Originally Posted by WeAreNottingham View Post
    Turns out the actor playing the builder in the ukip "EU policy at work" is an EU migrant.
    Some good political trolling by both parties.

    BTW just noticed this thread is at 100+ pages - a first of mine.


 

 

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